New Vintage Air ready for Freon - How to? - Team Camaro Tech
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post #1 of 67 (permalink) Old Jun 15th, 17, 12:51 AM Thread Starter
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New Vintage Air ready for Freon - How to?

I searched this site and had no luck. I am ready to put freon in my new Vintage Air system in my 69 SS396 Camaro. I have the AC hoses and I have a vacuum pump. I pulled a vacuum for two days and it held steady so no leaks. Now I am ready to put freon in it and I'm not sure how to do it.
I can make the connections with the blue and red connectors, then attach the can of freon to the yellow hose, then open the yellow valve. Then do I just open the blue valve or both blue and red valves?

I am also unsure of the initial start up of the Vintage air system. I am supposed to program the sliders with a calibration procedure. I am unsure when that occurs. Do I do that after I have the freon in it, or do I try turning the system on first? The instructions are not clear when to perform this step.

After reading the instructions from Vintage Air, it sounds like the system needs to be functional in order to charge it with freon, but I do not want to attempt turning the system on with no freon in it and risk damaging the system.

If anyone can help I would be grateful

Brett......


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post #2 of 67 (permalink) Old Jun 15th, 17, 04:40 AM
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Re: New Vintage Air ready for Freon - How to?

Program 1st. The compressor will not engage until the system is charged.
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post #3 of 67 (permalink) Old Jun 15th, 17, 04:48 AM
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Re: New Vintage Air ready for Freon - How to?

The customer service at VA is terrific and can guide you through the process. I think you mean 134 and not "Freon". If you are unsure you may want to bring it to a shop. Even though I installed the VA system, I had a local shop charge it up. Good luck and keep cool.
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post #4 of 67 (permalink) Old Jun 15th, 17, 08:48 AM
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Re: New Vintage Air ready for Freon - How to?

Brett

Here's a link to a Corvette forum that talks about AC charging. If you scroll through this it's very well documented what you need to do for a stock system. I've used this to charge my Vette and Camaro. I've never used an aftermarket system but can't imagine it being too different. Also, I have to believe vintage air has instructions online.

If you run into issues, we can try to help.

Good luck!

Ed

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post #5 of 67 (permalink) Old Jun 15th, 17, 08:57 AM
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Re: New Vintage Air ready for Freon - How to?

Quote:
Originally Posted by emdoller View Post
I've used this to charge my Vette and Camaro. I've never used an aftermarket system but can't imagine it being too different. Also, I have to believe vintage air has instructions online.
I would not assume that the aftermarket fill instructions are the same. I'm installing a Classic Auto Air system and the fill is done with the system off and a manual (hand) turn of the compressor clutch. Something about a reed valve style compressor not being filled while running. Check page 45 on these instructions: LINK

I was curious so I looked at VA's site and was surprised not to find any (maybe I missed them).

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post #6 of 67 (permalink) Old Jun 15th, 17, 09:03 AM
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Re: New Vintage Air ready for Freon - How to?

I too just checked the VA site and could only find this which isn't much. I'm surprised.

http://www.vintageair.com/Instructions2013/900004.pdf

If I read between the lines, it sounds similar to a stock system. I'd contact VA to make sure.

Please make sure you understand the process because things can get dangerous.

Ed
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post #7 of 67 (permalink) Old Jun 15th, 17, 09:09 AM
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Re: New Vintage Air ready for Freon - How to?

Here's what I just did on my stock system:

1) pull vacuum and make sure no leak
2) hook up guages
3) with car OFF, add 12oz of R12 through high and low side
4) turn off high both high and low side valves
5) start car and run at 1500-2000 rpm
6) add more R12 only using low side DO NOT OPEN HIGH SIDE WITH CAR RUNNING
7) add 3.75lbs watching to see if pressures are with guidelines
8) keep checking temp inside car to make sure it's cooling

Ed
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post #8 of 67 (permalink) Old Jun 15th, 17, 10:04 AM
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Re: New Vintage Air ready for Freon - How to?

Brett

Here's a link with directions and video. Hope this helps!

Ed

http://www.stevesnovasite.com/forums.../216762?page=1
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post #9 of 67 (permalink) Old Jun 15th, 17, 10:28 AM
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Re: New Vintage Air ready for Freon - How to?

I'm going to caution you that Vintage Air systems are very sensitive to the amount of R134. Use the exact amount specified by VA. No more, no less. Make sure you have a scale to measure the amount you use.

Don

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post #10 of 67 (permalink) Old Jun 15th, 17, 11:09 AM
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Re: New Vintage Air ready for Freon - How to?

Brett, you probably all ready got it by now but like John said, you need to dump what ever oil and 134 first before compressor will engage or use a jumper at the compressor .

I usually dump 2 oz or 4 oz oil that can be pulled into the vacuum first and if necessary,if your system is still on vacuum, put a can of gas on it.
I use a jumper wire with clips to engage compressor clutch but normally after you add the first gas can after oil , system will have enough pressure to allow clutch to come on .

You should have an empty oil can and gas ready to pull into the compressor while turning. You may have to turn your interior sensor switch all the way on or back a little. Just watch for compressor cycling on / off.

I usually watch my gauges for head pressure as well as the low side. Two cans should do it but watch the gauges and interior vents to check you air flow. If you have a vent thermometer into the air vents, that would should tell you where you are.

Don't forget to remove the jumper wires . That's a nice vacuum pump. I use a homemade pump off an old refrig or freezer.

Also remember those cans are not lbs, its oz's. like Don said, system is sensitive so don't put too much or your head pressure will be too high and system won't cool.

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post #11 of 67 (permalink) Old Jun 15th, 17, 11:58 AM
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Re: New Vintage Air ready for Freon - How to?

VA takes 1.8 lbs
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post #12 of 67 (permalink) Old Jun 16th, 17, 01:50 AM Thread Starter
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Re: New Vintage Air ready for Freon - How to?

I thought that 134a was just another version of Freon-shows my lack of knowledge in this area, lol.
Thanks Ed for the info and links. I see that there is a weight amount to be put in. I currently have 2 cans of 12oz ea 134a+. Looks like this has other ingredients in it, but the total is 24 oz. VA instructions show 28.8 oz. Should I get some different cans that have only 134a? and should I get another can in order to make the 28.8 oz requirement?
My compressor has what VA says is the required amount of oil in it, but it seemed like when I went to pull a vacuum on the system, when I opened the red valve (The valve on the compressor), it wanted to suck the oil out of the compressor, because it was blowing out of the vacuum pump. I didn't lose that much oil tho, 'cause each time it did that, I shut it off. I wound up just pulling the vacuum using the blue valve.
So, what I will do is program the A/C unit first, and get the sliders programmed.
Then attach the hoses onto the A/C system
Start the car
A/C unit off
Screw the can of 134a onto the yellow hose (do the valves need to be closed before screwing can of 134a?)
Open both blue and red valves
Do I "roll" the can from bottom to top while it is being installed?
After can is expelled, close both valves
Turn on A/C
attach second can
Open both valves
After second can is installed, close both valves.
I just don't want to screw this up, and I do know a guy, but he will go by his notes and I really don't trust having someone do it that needs notes to remember what to do (I don't trust his notes).
I could also contact VA, but there is a correct set of steps that need to be done in exact order and I might not get that on the phone with VA.
I might be over thinking this, but thats okay, cause I surely don't want to under think it, haha.

Thanks all!

Brett.....


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post #13 of 67 (permalink) Old Jun 16th, 17, 06:08 AM
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Re: New Vintage Air ready for Freon - How to?

You really should call VA. It looks like they use the Sanden compressors (like Classic Auto Air). CAA's instructions say not to rotate the can as no liquid should enter the system. I would also check Sanden's site to see what instructions they have for that model compressor.

I would put together your suggested fill procedure and send it to VA. Let them tell you the right thing for their system. At least then if something goes wrong, they should be on the hook.

Although, they may tell you to bring it to a professional. Hate that.

George
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post #14 of 67 (permalink) Old Jun 16th, 17, 06:16 AM
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Re: New Vintage Air ready for Freon - How to?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brettallen59 View Post
I thought that 134a was just another version of Freon-shows my lack of knowledge in this area, lol.
Thanks Ed for the info and links. I see that there is a weight amount to be put in. I currently have 2 cans of 12oz ea 134a+. Looks like this has other ingredients in it, but the total is 24 oz. VA instructions show 28.8 oz. Should I get some different cans that have only 134a? and should I get another can in order to make the 28.8 oz requirement?
My compressor has what VA says is the required amount of oil in it, but it seemed like when I went to pull a vacuum on the system, when I opened the red valve (The valve on the compressor), it wanted to suck the oil out of the compressor, because it was blowing out of the vacuum pump. I didn't lose that much oil tho, 'cause each time it did that, I shut it off. I wound up just pulling the vacuum using the blue valve.
So, what I will do is program the A/C unit first, and get the sliders programmed.
Then attach the hoses onto the A/C system
Start the car
A/C unit off
Screw the can of 134a onto the yellow hose (do the valves need to be closed before screwing can of 134a?)
Open both blue and red valves
Do I "roll" the can from bottom to top while it is being installed?
After can is expelled, close both valves
Turn on A/C
attach second can
Open both valves
After second can is installed, close both valves.
I just don't want to screw this up, and I do know a guy, but he will go by his notes and I really don't trust having someone do it that needs notes to remember what to do (I don't trust his notes).
I could also contact VA, but there is a correct set of steps that need to be done in exact order and I might not get that on the phone with VA.
I might be over thinking this, but thats okay, cause I surely don't want to under think it, haha.

Thanks all!

Brett.....

Brett

It's always good to make sure you get it right before starting. The video in the link I posted does a good job showing what to do. Watch a few times.

It's good that the compressor was shipped with oil.

To answer your questions.

1) I'm not familiar with the additives in the 134 you have. I'd recommend you get pure 134.
2) turn both high and low side off
3) hook up high side and keep it off
4) hook up can to yellow making sure both valves are off
5) before you attach the low side, open the low valve letting some of the 134 through the hose to purge the air then quickly hook it up
6) once it's hooked up turn it off
7) start car and charge by opening low side valve. You need to be patient and may need to heat the can to get it all out. This can be done with a bucket of warm water or a heat gun. Keep the top of the can up at all times and out of the water.
8) when you switch to next can, turn valve off and purge line again.

Make sure you only add the amount VA states. Watch the video I posted and read his instructions 3 times.

Good luck!

Ed
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post #15 of 67 (permalink) Old Jun 16th, 17, 03:11 PM Thread Starter
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Re: New Vintage Air ready for Freon - How to?

Quote:
Originally Posted by emdoller View Post
Brett

It's always good to make sure you get it right before starting. The video in the link I posted does a good job showing what to do. Watch a few times.

It's good that the compressor was shipped with oil.

To answer your questions.

1) I'm not familiar with the additives in the 134 you have. I'd recommend you get pure 134.
2) turn both high and low side off
3) hook up high side and keep it off
4) hook up can to yellow making sure both valves are off
5) before you attach the low side, open the low valve letting some of the 134 through the hose to purge the air then quickly hook it up
6) once it's hooked up turn it off
7) start car and charge by opening low side valve. You need to be patient and may need to heat the can to get it all out. This can be done with a bucket of warm water or a heat gun. Keep the top of the can up at all times and out of the water.
8) when you switch to next can, turn valve off and purge line again.

Make sure you only add the amount VA states. Watch the video I posted and read his instructions 3 times.

Good luck!

Ed

Ed,
Now THAT was what I was looking for! I can understand that perfectly. You are the MAN! I surely would have screwed it all up, especially not knowing to purge the line before connecting it. Man, I really, really appreciate it. I will go get 28.8 oz of straight 134A.

Brett.....

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