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Old Aug 23rd, 06, 05:07 AM   #1 (permalink)
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To those who say the new Camaro isn't retro enough...

Bob Lutz has a comment on that very topic

IMO the new Camaro has a great blend of retro and current/future styling.
As much as I love the new Mustang design, I'm already bored with all of the different tuner versions. It's overdone already IMO...

Nice work GM

http://www.jalopnik.com/cars/news/ma...ump-195655.php
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Old Aug 23rd, 06, 02:01 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Re: To those who say the new Camaro isn't retro enough...

and your point is???
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Old Aug 23rd, 06, 02:05 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Re: To those who say the new Camaro isn't retro enough...

Quote:
Originally Posted by OverAnxious View Post
Bob Lutz has a comment on that very topic

IMO the new Camaro has a great blend of retro and current/future styling.
As much as I love the new Mustang design, I'm already bored with all of the different tuner versions. It's overdone already IMO...

Nice work GM

http://www.jalopnik.com/cars/news/ma...ump-195655.php
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocketrod View Post
and your point is???

His point is that he likes it
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Old Aug 23rd, 06, 02:07 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Re: To those who say the new Camaro isn't retro enough...

That Multi-Quote function is neato
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Old Aug 23rd, 06, 02:39 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Re: To those who say the new Camaro isn't retro enough...

It is cool
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Old Aug 23rd, 06, 03:10 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Re: To those who say the new Camaro isn't retro enough...

That is their mistake!!!
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Old Aug 23rd, 06, 03:21 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Re: To those who say the new Camaro isn't retro enough...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocketrod View Post
and your point is???
Nice ---

It gives some info on their reasoning and the direction they chose to take
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Old Aug 23rd, 06, 09:21 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Re: To those who say the new Camaro isn't retro enough...

Yea, but we all know how it turned out when Bob Lutz followed his own ways instead of what the car buying public wanted with the 04-06 GTO. How'd that one turn out Bob? You'll sell more of them if more people like them, no matter what you think about how retro it should or shouldn't be. Alot of people like the new design, but more people want it to be more retro.I thought GM was in business to give the public what it wants, not just what Mr. Lutz wants.
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Old Aug 23rd, 06, 10:24 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Re: To those who say the new Camaro isn't retro enough...

The Thunderbird was retro, and it did pretty well

The retro approach can be risky.
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Old Aug 24th, 06, 04:12 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Re: To those who say the new Camaro isn't retro enough...

Quote:
Originally Posted by 69X11 View Post
Yea, but we all know how it turned out when Bob Lutz followed his own ways instead of what the car buying public wanted with the 04-06 GTO. How'd that one turn out Bob? You'll sell more of them if more people like them, no matter what you think about how retro it should or shouldn't be. Alot of people like the new design, but more people want it to be more retro.I thought GM was in business to give the public what it wants, not just what Mr. Lutz wants.
Comparing this car to the previous GTO is like apples and oranges IMO.
The GTO was slammed into production. They took an existing car, made some cosmetic changes and had to pay to ship them to the USA to sell them. That alone bumped up the cost.

Lack of styling and price killed the GTO IMO.

This car is being engineered from the ground up on a shared platform, hardley the same thing.

Does this mean it will succeed? Of course not. How GM prices it will have a huge impact.
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Old Aug 24th, 06, 04:12 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Re: To those who say the new Camaro isn't retro enough...

Quote:
Originally Posted by RamAirDave View Post
The Thunderbird was retro, and it did pretty well

The retro approach can be risky.
That Thunderbird looked good.

Price and lack of performance killed that car. Building it on the Lincoln LS/Jag chassis made for an nice ride but they overpriced it.
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Old Aug 24th, 06, 09:10 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Re: To those who say the new Camaro isn't retro enough...

Anyone who compares the previous GTO to the new Camaro or feels the new Camaro should be more retro because (allegedly) that's what the buying public wants...needs to be thoroughly educated in how the United States automotive industry works

You people forget the type of customers that we are selling our cars to. This is not 1944 or 1967....it's 2006. We are dealing with a cynical buying public. One that tires easily of their cars and is always looking for the latest and greatest and hippest thing out there. Products are like chewing gum today....they chew the hell out of it until the flavor's gone then they spit it out on the sidewalk and start frantically looking for another peice. Case in point...Thunderbird. A great car....a great design....took the world by storm when it debuted. 5 years later....canceled. Why? Because everyone that wanted one bought one....and when all those people had been satisfied...the market dried up. With nowhere to take the design from where it was (because it was so damn retro) they had no choice but to cancel it. Challanger will be no different. Again....a great car....I personally love it. But as soon as the first one rolls off the assembly line you can go ahead and start counting the days until it's canceled. There is no "reach" in those products. They all come out of the gate with a proverbial dead end in their sights. Like a metorite entering the atmosphere....bright and brilliant at first, but then quickly fades away. You watch....after everyone that "wants one" gets one, the demand for those cars will fade to the point where it will no longer be worth it for Chrysle....er, I mean....the Germans to build it. And I guarantee Mustang will be drastically different when they have to build a new one in a few years. That will effect sales....don't think it won't.

And a word about GTO. For the love of God will you SHUT UP about the damn GTO already. Like Overanxious said....apples to oranges. Actually...this might be closer to apples and spinach....they're not even in the same food group. One was a spinoff from an existing car already in production, the other is being designed from the ground up right from the start to be what it will be. We only did the GTO to fill a void in the Rear Wheel Drive performance segment. I don't know that the General had any high hopes for it....but hell they had to take a chance, they needed SOMETHING...ANYTHING. Did it work out for us? No. But at least we offered something instead of sitting on our thumbs for 3 years. The GTO is a great car to drive...and it's fast. If it had been called something like the Pontiac G8...none of you would have said boo about it. I am confident that we are taking our car in the right direction and that we will get the last laugh on all of them. And through the years this Camaro is only going to get better and better and better because it's design will give it the reach to be updated several times for a longer shelf life. If you don't want to be a part of the party...then go sit in your garage with your 2008 Challanger. Hope the novelty lasts long enough for ya.
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Old Aug 24th, 06, 09:20 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Re: To those who say the new Camaro isn't retro enough...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Infamous View Post
Anyone who compares the previous GTO to the new Camaro or feels the new Camaro should be more retro because (allegedly) that's what the buying public wants...needs to be thoroughly educated in how the United States automotive industry works

You people forget the type of customers that we are selling our cars to. This is not 1944 or 1967....it's 2006. We are dealing with a cynical buying public. One that tires easily of their cars and is always looking for the latest and greatest and hippest thing out there. Products are like chewing gum today....they chew the hell out of it until the flavor's gone then they spit it out on the sidewalk and start frantically looking for another peice. Case in point...Thunderbird. A great car....a great design....took the world by storm when it debuted. 5 years later....canceled. Why? Because everyone that wanted one bought one....and when all those people had been satisfied...the market dried up. With nowhere to take the design from where it was (because it was so damn retro) they had no choice but to cancel it. Challanger will be no different. Again....a great car....I personally love it. But as soon as the first one rolls off the assembly line you can go ahead and start counting the days until it's canceled. There is no "reach" in those products. They all come out of the gate with a proverbial dead end in their sights. Like a metorite entering the atmosphere....bright and brilliant at first, but then quickly fades away. You watch....after everyone that "wants one" gets one, the demand for those cars will fade to the point where it will no longer be worth it for Chrysle....er, I mean....the Germans to build it. And I guarantee Mustang will be drastically different when they have to build a new one in a few years. That wll effect sales....don't think it won't.

And a word about GTO. For the love of God will you SHUT UP about the damn GTO already. Like Overanxious said....apples to oranges. Actually...this might be closer to apples and spinach....they're not even the same food. One was a spinoff from an existing car already in production, the other is being designed from the ground up right from the start to be what it will be. We only did the GTO to fill a void in the Rear Wheel Drive performance segment. I don't know that the General had any high hopes for it....but hell they had to take a chance, they needed SOMETHING...ANYTHING. Did it work out for us? No. But at least we offered something instead of sitting on our thumbs for 3 years. The GTO is a great car to drive...and it's fast. If it had been called something like the Pontiac G8...none of you would have said boo about it.

There....I think I ranted long enough. Actually I don't know why I even bothered typing this. This is an arguement that can't be won.
Very well stated
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Old Aug 24th, 06, 09:49 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Wink Re: To those who say the new Camaro isn't retro enough...

GM paraded the new Camaro this past Friday morning at the Woodward Cruise. when the driver (whoever he was) started the engine, it black-smoked out the pipes....like a stuck choke would do............................
that's retro
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Old Aug 24th, 06, 10:26 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Re: To those who say the new Camaro isn't retro enough...

Quote:
Originally Posted by 69X11 View Post
Alot of people like the new design, but more people want it to be more retro.I thought GM was in business to give the public what it wants, not just what Mr. Lutz wants.
Where do your statistics come from? Is this from a poll or are you shooting from the hip based on your own personal bias? I'm somehow not convinced you are in touch with the entire buyer's market for this car.
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