Powerjection installation - Team Camaro Tech
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post #1 of 11 (permalink) Old Apr 28th, 10, 08:31 AM Thread Starter
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John
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Norfolk Nebraska
Posts: 74
Powerjection installation

I have installed a powerjection system in my car and wonder if any one has been using one in there ride. Mine is the older powerjection 1 and it is on my 461 big block. I just started the car and when it is cold I have to put my foot into the throttle to keep it running. Maybe I should give it more time to learn my motor. Thanks

1968 396 SS Red/Red Deluxe interior.
Been updated to a 460ci
Powerjection 1
700r4
oirginal 12 Bolt.

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post #2 of 11 (permalink) Old Apr 28th, 10, 07:34 PM
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Steiner
 
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Location: Lyman, SC
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Re: Powerjection installation

I had the same problem with mine (Powerjection III) but since I was pulling the engine I didn't play with it a whole lot. Hot starts were awesome but cold starts took some pedal feathering and sometimes didn't want to fire right away. I went in and messed with the IAC settings, the fuel prime settings, decay settings, and fuel tables for cranking. It got better but wasn't all the way there yet when I pulled the engine. If it has the same issue on the new engine I'll call Retrotek and see what they say.

'69 Camaro
Dart 400-AFR 195-224/224 HR-Powerjection III TB with F.A.S.T. Sportsman XFI
TKO 600-Moser 3.42-Detroit Truetrac
500hp/538lbft

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'69 Camaro Beater-SFT 327-M20-Moser 4.10-sold
'02 Z/28 vert-stock-sold and totaled
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post #3 of 11 (permalink) Old Apr 29th, 10, 06:07 AM
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Bob
 
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Location: Littleton, Co.
Posts: 516
Re: Powerjection installation

I have the older boss EFI or stage 2. Mine also is hesitant when cold. I have moved the cold start slider bar over and it has help. Still playing with it to fine tune it. I also installed colder plugs because I installed a procharger, this worsens the condition.

_______________________________
69 Camaro, Air Ride Suspension,
Procharged HO 454, 700R4, 12 bolt with Yukon axles, 3:73 gears posi, Pypes 2.5" X pipe with Borla XS mufflers. Retrotek Speed EFI, Ridetech suspension.
Rushforth rated X with Toyo tires. MSD 6 ignition.
Wilwood 6 piston Dynalite disc brakes with Hydratech booster.
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post #4 of 11 (permalink) Old May 2nd, 10, 05:43 PM
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Chet
 
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Location: Northern Ohio
Posts: 106
Re: Powerjection installation

Went to a cruise Friday nite and a guy came in and parked beside me in a 73 Plymouth Duster with a 360 that has a mild build in it. As he opened the hood I was coming over to see what he has since I am an old Mopar guy myself before converting over to my Camaro 25 years ago. He has the Projection III system on it and he said he gave up on trying to get a carb to run on the motor. He said that it was a pretty staight forward install and when he finished putting in the necessary questions into the hand held progarammer, it fired right up with no problems and runs great. He said starting and the throttle response are amazing along with the better fuel mileage. I have been reading a talking to those who have used one of these systems or the FAST EZ system since this what I am going to next spring. I don't want anything where I need a lap top or other special tuning devices to make it work on my 406.

White and silver 82 Z-28 with a built 406 running a built 700R4 trans with 3000 stall convertor with 3.73 rear gears. Maroon interior with B+M mega shifter Autometer gauges. Custom 17" wheels and tires and C-5 Vette front brakes. Rear discs coming.
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post #5 of 11 (permalink) Old May 6th, 10, 06:37 AM
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Steiner
 
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Re: Powerjection installation

John,

I don't know if you talked to Cody at Retrotek yet but I spoke with him for a few minutes yesterday. Here is some of the insight he gave me. I just copied it from a post in Fred's thread. He has the Powerjection I and it wants to fall apart under 2K.

-------
Fred, you may have the same issue I do although more pronounced.

I talked to Cody at Retrotek today about mine running so rich at idle and low speed. He said that for the base map to autotune, it had to be within a certain range already because it would only add or subtract so much. They did that because guys would run their cars out of gas with autotune running and the program would jack the fuel addition in the map way up then the car wouldn't want to start because it would flood once they put gas in it. So essentially if the map is already way rich it will only bring the value down 25% and no more so it bottoms out.

Cody said to get the idle cleaned up, to start it cold and then gradually bring the torque value you input to create the base map down lower and lower and recalculate (it loads the map immediately when you recalculate) until it cleans up. Then when you're close, autotune will kick in at 150 degrees coolant temp and be able fine tune it the rest of the way. The base fuel curves are directly related to the torque value you input but he said it's not a perfect world situation.
----------

Now, I went out this morning and the first thing I did was turn the key on, open the software, and check the fuel tables. Sure enough there was -25 in several cells which meant it had subtracted the maximum amount of fuel it could. So I changed my torque value in the fuel calibration map to 490 (was 525) and recalculated. I hit START and the car immediately fired up and held idle. It has never done that cold before.

I then lowered the torque to 470 and recalculated. The AFR came up some and so did vacuum. So I took it out for a 25 mile drive or so to heat it up and let it start autotuning from there. It was still running rich at light loads (high vacuum) and lower RPMs. I have a 0.64 overdrive and 3.42 rear but was still able to tool around at 1500 RPM in fifth gear and take some rolling hills.

I got home and let it sit running while I played with the software some. The idle had come up to about 1100 or so and low AFR (rich). I am running with the idle cell enabled and noticed that it was supposed to go to the idle setting (can see it in the fuel tables or real time data) at a vac reading of 50, below 1200 RPM, TPS less than 3. I had everything but the vacuum and it was reading high so it was jumping back and forth between the idle cell and base fuel map for low RPM. I changed the vac to 70 and it went into idle mode which has a 13.5 AFR target right now.

It wouldn't get there so I kept dropping the torque down and recalculating. At 400 lb ft it jumped lean finally and then was able to tune to 13.5 and vacuum came up. You could hear the exhaust note change. I turned the throttle blades down a little to get my idle closer to 800, shut it off, and did a TPS recalibration.

I think I'm getting somewhere now. I think a combination of the cam profiles you have to select and torque values can throw the fuel map out of whack. What I hope doesn't happen is that at high RPM's it can't get enough fuel because the fueling goes to +25. I'll drive it some more tomorrow and see what happens.

The FAST system probably doesn't have this issue because there is probably not a limit on the fuel it can add or subtract when it is autotuning. Since the Retrotek unit does have the limit (because of people running out of gas and complaining) your base map has to be within 25% of where it needs to be right off the bat so it winds up limiting what autotune can do.

'69 Camaro
Dart 400-AFR 195-224/224 HR-Powerjection III TB with F.A.S.T. Sportsman XFI
TKO 600-Moser 3.42-Detroit Truetrac
500hp/538lbft

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'69 Camaro Beater-SFT 327-M20-Moser 4.10-sold
'02 Z/28 vert-stock-sold and totaled
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post #6 of 11 (permalink) Old May 15th, 10, 06:56 AM Thread Starter
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John
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Norfolk Nebraska
Posts: 74
Re: Powerjection installation

Hello I have checked my ecm on the lean out condition and it looks like my system does go minus more than 25%. I have some at -31%. I still haven't called Cody about the programing I just put my foot into the injector plate when I start the engine in the mornings. It does take some time to fire but does run alright after about a minute. I have a race roller cam and has 10 ins of vacuum. Also my programing doesn't have adjustments for lowering torque values but I do have unlimited fuel adjustments of which I don't know much about at this time.
Anyway I am still playing with the system and am happy so far with it.
Thanks

1968 396 SS Red/Red Deluxe interior.
Been updated to a 460ci
Powerjection 1
700r4
oirginal 12 Bolt.

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post #7 of 11 (permalink) Old May 15th, 10, 08:01 AM
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Steiner
 
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Location: Lyman, SC
Posts: 8,348
Re: Powerjection installation

According to Cody, if you have to put your foot to the floor to start it then it is getting too much fuel and needs more air.

You can add more steps to the IAC value for cold cranking or you can just lower your fuel map for the sub-1000 RPM areas. Adding IAC steps did not help but dropping fuel did on mine.

I know our programs are probably different. Mine has been starting perfect since lowering the torque value and recalculating the base map to lean it out.

One other thing....does yours have the RPM follower function that uses the IAC to control idle and an idle cell setting for AFR and fuel? On mine it has to be below a specific MAP (vacuum) level, be below 1200 RPM and TPS below 2 to go into the idle cell. The vacuum limit was too low on mine so it was jumping back and forth between the idle cell and main fuel map. Bumping the MAP value up cured that.

'69 Camaro
Dart 400-AFR 195-224/224 HR-Powerjection III TB with F.A.S.T. Sportsman XFI
TKO 600-Moser 3.42-Detroit Truetrac
500hp/538lbft

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'69 Camaro Beater-SFT 327-M20-Moser 4.10-sold
'02 Z/28 vert-stock-sold and totaled
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post #8 of 11 (permalink) Old May 20th, 10, 06:52 AM Thread Starter
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John
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Norfolk Nebraska
Posts: 74
Re: Powerjection installation

Hello Steiner
I downloaded your dashboard to see what you were adjusting as my system has a different dashboard. I don't have all the adjustment that you have in your system. My system isn't got the limitations in the auto tuner but I do have fuel adjustments that I have to learn how to use. I don't have very much knowledge on tuning.
I did talk to cody yesterday about my problems and he told me to put the base line tune from the factory back in the ecm and start at that place. When I got the system in the car I just took out the original program out and put one off there website in to start my car. So Will try that next.
Thanks

1968 396 SS Red/Red Deluxe interior.
Been updated to a 460ci
Powerjection 1
700r4
oirginal 12 Bolt.

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post #9 of 11 (permalink) Old Jun 7th, 10, 05:15 PM Thread Starter
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John
 
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Location: Norfolk Nebraska
Posts: 74
Re: Powerjection installation

Hello
I just got back from a goodguys run with the car and the car overheated this year. I don't know if the injection being to lean might have done it or not. I keep trying to call cody and haven't talked to him yet. I did talk to someone else and he told me to put the orginal program from the factory back in the ecm. It was setup for small block!!! I did that and haven't had time to check to motor sense. It seemed to run better though. Also I did put in colder plugs just before I went to the run.
Does anyone have a problem with the engine running to lean and overheating Too??
I am going to check tomorrow with my laptop to see what the system learned from the trip.
If I could talk to someone that runs the powerjection 1 as I don't have all the new ways to program lower torque values or any of the other neat changes that powerjection 3 has. That might help me and I will talk to Cody as soon as I can.
Thanks
John

1968 396 SS Red/Red Deluxe interior.
Been updated to a 460ci
Powerjection 1
700r4
oirginal 12 Bolt.

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post #10 of 11 (permalink) Old Jun 9th, 10, 05:52 AM
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Bob
 
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Re: Powerjection installation

Call Cody and talk to him. Sounds like your load is off. It only can adjust no more than 30% automatically. They do this so if you run out of gas it doesnt lean out the car. Then when you restart with gas in the Tank it isnt to lean. So he needs to send you a new load that gets it in the range then the auto tuning can do its magic. Also is your TPS calibrated?

_______________________________
69 Camaro, Air Ride Suspension,
Procharged HO 454, 700R4, 12 bolt with Yukon axles, 3:73 gears posi, Pypes 2.5" X pipe with Borla XS mufflers. Retrotek Speed EFI, Ridetech suspension.
Rushforth rated X with Toyo tires. MSD 6 ignition.
Wilwood 6 piston Dynalite disc brakes with Hydratech booster.
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post #11 of 11 (permalink) Old Jun 16th, 10, 05:30 AM Thread Starter
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John
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Norfolk Nebraska
Posts: 74
Re: Powerjection installation

Hello I have the original tune that he told me to put in. I put colder plugs in and I checked the tune with my laptop monday. The all around condition is a -8 so it is getting close. I should call them today and talk to him. I seems like I can't get him very much when I do call!!! Thanks John

1968 396 SS Red/Red Deluxe interior.
Been updated to a 460ci
Powerjection 1
700r4
oirginal 12 Bolt.

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