Blown or not? - Team Camaro Tech
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post #1 of 63 (permalink) Old Nov 8th, 09, 09:14 AM Thread Starter
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Blown or not?

Got a quick question for you guys runnin blowers......should I do it? My engine combo is a brand new 496, stock 2-bolt block, Scat cast steel crank, stock 6.135 rods w/good bolts, KB hyper flat top pistons, Renegade (Procomp) 320 heads with 2.30/1.88 valves, Comp hydraulic Big Mutha Thumpr cam. C/R is somewhere between 8.8-9.2. I like the idea of keeping my new 6" cowl hood intact (no hole), so the Weiand 177 or 174 looks good at 3 lbs of boost(and only one carb to adjust), but those big ol' huffers like the 256/6-71/8-71 sure do look wicked comin thru the hood. My concern is the lack of forged internals in the 496, plus the heat generated by the blower (plus my lack of knowledge on em in general). Whatcha all think? I don't plan on racing it, just a weekend cruiser.
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I may be old and slow, but ........what the heck was I gonna say?
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post #2 of 63 (permalink) Old Nov 9th, 09, 08:41 AM
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Re: Blown or not?

I have a ZZ502 with a 8/71 blower. It has 9.1 compression. It is all stock internals but I had the crank balanced and double keyways. The block is oringed and so are the heads. I have Dart pro1 325 heads with a Hydralic roller cam. I would suggest using a blower cam. The higher the compression you go the hotter it will run. Mine will get 200/205 idiling for a hour in traffic at Cruisin the Coast in mississippi.

So yes your motor can handle it but maybe change the cam. My motor puts out 8lbs boost @6000 rpm.

Just the blower sticking out the hood and the blower whine will get all the attention you will want.

Go for it. You wont be sorry. It did take me about 6 months to figure it out.

Here is some good info on blowers.

http://www.blowerdriveservice.com/faq.php
http://www.blowerdriveservice.com/techcharts.php#

Mike
69 Camaro Prostreet - purple w/ghost flames , 502 w/ 871 blower


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post #3 of 63 (permalink) Old Nov 9th, 09, 08:42 AM
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Re: Blown or not?

Injection is nice but id rather be blown!!!..OR PROCHARGERS ARE NICE TOO!!..bottom end seems good..question for you blower guys?? why do you not put good rods in there??..
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post #4 of 63 (permalink) Old Nov 9th, 09, 09:22 AM
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Re: Blown or not?

FI is the only way to go IMO.

My procharged 01 SS made 579.7 Rwhp with only a small blower cam and forged pistons. I was also running the smallest head unit that ATI offered. figure a 10% powertrain loss and thats over 600HP and still pump gas friendly.

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Last edited by Jeremiah; Nov 9th, 09 at 05:40 PM.
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post #5 of 63 (permalink) Old Nov 9th, 09, 05:52 PM
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Re: Blown or not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by tilley88 View Post
Got a quick question for you guys runnin blowers......should I do it? My engine combo is a brand new 496, stock 2-bolt block, Scat cast steel crank, stock 6.135 rods w/good bolts, KB hyper flat top pistons, Renegade (Procomp) 320 heads with 2.30/1.88 valves, Comp hydraulic Big Mutha Thumpr cam. C/R is somewhere between 8.8-9.2. I like the idea of keeping my new 6" cowl hood intact (no hole), so the Weiand 177 or 174 looks good at 3 lbs of boost(and only one carb to adjust), but those big ol' huffers like the 256/6-71/8-71 sure do look wicked comin thru the hood. My concern is the lack of forged internals in the 496, plus the heat generated by the blower (plus my lack of knowledge on em in general). Whatcha all think? I don't plan on racing it, just a weekend cruiser.
I am a bigger fan of a purpose built blown combo from the pan to carb.
Not to say that a small roots like you mentioned would not work on your combo..it is something I would do in a heart beat if your mind is set on it and want to keep it under the cowl hood.At 3lbs of boost..that 496 will be a ground pounder with the baby blower.The internals will be fine at this power level and street rpm and not tax the crank snout with a serpentine drive belt with the correct supplied tensioner.
As you well know..that many cubes are calling for an 8 series for max output..but the baby blowers have there place on a street deal and move some air at low rpm due to there 2-1 drive ratio.Put the biggest 4150 carb on top you can find,hp1000.Roots blowers in any size hate inlet restriction.Unless its to late..consider a boost friendly camshaft.Typically will favour the exhaust side with 10* more duration and have the lsa in the 114* range to reduce overlap.To much exhaust scavenging with a tight lsa will have a portion of your boosted charge shoot straight into the primary header tube.The blower case and its internals will not tax your cooling system in itself,it is the additional heat in the cylinders from the increase in power that will need to addressed.No different if you made the same power n/a.Simply takes longer to cool down with the added mass of a lung.The centrifugals are great power adders that you can hide under the hood.Easily will stomp a baby roots in the power dept.If you are tune up challenged,you will dial in the draw thru carb atop the roots long before you get a handle on a blow thru carb with a centrifugal.
Hope some of this helps you with your decision.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SPARKY69 View Post
Injection is nice but id rather be blown!!!..OR PROCHARGERS ARE NICE TOO!!..bottom end seems good..question for you blower guys?? why do you not put good rods in there??..
Can not speak for everyone..but my purpose built blown big block sports Lunati Pro Mod rods rated to 1000 hp with 7/16ths cap screws torqued to 75 ft/lbs.ARP studded 4 bolt main 512 block with a double keyed nitrated 5140 crank and ati superdampner.

George
68 Camaro
8-71 blown 461 Rat on E-85

Last edited by fatblock; Nov 9th, 09 at 06:12 PM.
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post #6 of 63 (permalink) Old Nov 9th, 09, 06:20 PM
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Re: Blown or not?

Man i just love when George gets all serious and lays down the laws on American Muscle.

I NEED TO HIT THE LOTTERY
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post #7 of 63 (permalink) Old Nov 10th, 09, 03:23 AM
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Re: Blown or not?

Of course I vote for the blower. I'm with George, t is always better to build an engine for the blower.

As far as heat, blowers really don't add heat, power is heat. In 99% of the cases where blown motors are running hot, it's due to the timing and or running them too lean. There is no reason for a blown engine to run much hotter than a N/A engine. You just need a decent cooling system.

The learning curve really isn't that steep if you have basic tuning knowledge.

If you can swing a set of lower compression pistons and squeaze out 6lbs of boost you will really enjoy it and not have to worry about a melt down.

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post #8 of 63 (permalink) Old Nov 10th, 09, 03:17 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Blown or not?

Thanks for the info guys......I think I'll go with the 177 and a cam swap. I still have the cam that came with the engine when I bought it. It was never fired. I was told that cam was for monster torque. I'll have to get the specs for it, but I believe it's a low lift (.520") grind which will prolly work good for my spring setup. I would really hate to tear down my engine again for a valve spring swap or setup. Any recommendations for a good low lift hydraulic blower cam?

I may be old and slow, but ........what the heck was I gonna say?
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post #9 of 63 (permalink) Old Nov 10th, 09, 05:04 PM
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Re: Blown or not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by tilley88 View Post
. I would really hate to tear down my engine again for a valve spring swap or setup. Any recommendations for a good low lift hydraulic blower cam?
Jeff..would you consider a solid vs hydraulic cam?
I am not big on heavy mushy lifters in any big block,let alone roots blown.
Float a valve n/a will see a dip in the torque curve,dance an intake valve off its seat with a roots blower brings new meaning to the big bang theory.
I run a crower 01322.Grind #300f.Only requires 120lbs seat/335lbs open.
Lift is .529/.544 Duration at .050* is 246/254 on a 114* lsa.Advertised duration is 300/310* with edm cool face lifters for long life at low rpm street cruising.
I am by no means suggesting that an hydraulic will not be suitable..I simply believe that it is easier to control the valve train with a solid lifter when you blow off the tires or miss a shift at wot with a blown unit.

George
68 Camaro
8-71 blown 461 Rat on E-85
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post #10 of 63 (permalink) Old Nov 11th, 09, 09:47 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Blown or not?

I am very open to running a solid grind........preferred 'em myself over hydraulic in my roundy round cars.

I may be old and slow, but ........what the heck was I gonna say?
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post #11 of 63 (permalink) Old Nov 11th, 09, 10:48 AM
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Re: Blown or not?

solid is much better....
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post #12 of 63 (permalink) Old Nov 11th, 09, 07:50 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Blown or not?

Would a B&M 250 be overkill? I found a fella who's got a complete polished setup for sale for $1500 plus the ride. It's got the 16 groove pulley setup, not cog. Also has the single carb top, which I like. That new Holley 850 that JDR built for me flows around 1000 cfm, so that would be a killer carb on top of that 250......

I may be old and slow, but ........what the heck was I gonna say?
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post #13 of 63 (permalink) Old Nov 11th, 09, 08:17 PM
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Re: Blown or not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by tilley88 View Post
Would a B&M 250 be overkill? I found a fella who's got a complete polished setup for sale for $1500 plus the ride. It's got the 16 groove pulley setup, not cog. Also has the single carb top, which I like. That new Holley 850 that JDR built for me flows around 1000 cfm, so that would be a killer carb on top of that 250......
No that is not overkill at all and a decent price. That blower fits your application better than the smaller one too. You might need more carb than you have, but it's a start.

Royce (NO XQSSS) Bradley

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post #14 of 63 (permalink) Old Nov 12th, 09, 10:12 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Blown or not?

Royce, what brand scoop is that on your single plane setup?

I may be old and slow, but ........what the heck was I gonna say?
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post #15 of 63 (permalink) Old Nov 12th, 09, 03:53 PM
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Re: Blown or not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by tilley88 View Post
Royce, what brand scoop is that on your single plane setup?
That was a B&M scoop. Bought it from Summit Racing many years ago it is now on a friend of mines Nova (along with my old engine).

Royce (NO XQSSS) Bradley

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