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hey guys im on s tight budget for rebuilding the front subframe of my 67 camaro. i have torn it down to a bare subframe and was going to use the factory control arms, infact i have already purchased the front end replacement kit. BUT...i was looking on ebay and found 3 different tubular control arms for under 500.00. is there one out there for 500 or less that is better than the others?? i know the ball joints will be junk on most of them, but i was more worried about the a arms hitting the spindles, rotors, etc.. have you guys purchase the ones from pro comp or ccp? please advise.
 

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hey kelly heres a link i found if you do a search under tubular a arms or factory a arms alot pops up that might better answer your questions on this. if you read the posts in this link (not many on this particular one) but it also tells you what to search for to get all your answers. :thumbsup: http://www.camaros.net/forums/showthread.php?t=177701&highlight=arms+factory+tubular good luck man i hope this helps you out.
 

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hey kelly i forgot to ask, just a quick question not that they are wrong by any meens but is there a reason you want to get tubular a arms and not run your factory ones? the reason i ask is you say your on a tight budget and if you just plan on cruising around or even just having fun in it the factory a arms will do just fine for you and you can use that 500$ or so for something else you might need. im not sure how extensive your car build might be but that's just a thought. well good luck man and post up some pics for us we'd all love to see your car.
:beers:
 

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what can i do to factory a -arms to improve performance?? dont want to cut on them. just bolt in parts please.
 

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If you don't want to do the guldstrand mod, just change your upper control arms. Cheap kits are usually that... cheap kits. You get what you pay for.
 

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If you don't want to do the guldstrand mod, just change your upper control arms. Cheap kits are usually that... cheap kits. You get what you pay for.
Upper control arms with stock height ball joints are NOT a substitute for the G-mod.
 

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Some upper control arm's have similar corrections done to them similar to the G-mod.

The cheap arm's are just copy's of a stock arm. These are usually meant for Dirt track stock cars and not road vehicles.
No, they don't have similar corrections done to them similar to the G-mod unless they also include tall ball joints. They may build in more caster, and as a result of that additional caster have slightly more camber in a turn, but they do not provide camber gain like the G-mod/tall ball joints/tall spindle.
 

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No, they don't have similar corrections done to them similar to the G-mod unless they also include tall ball joints. They may build in more caster, and as a result of that additional caster have slightly more camber in a turn, but they do not provide camber gain like the G-mod/tall ball joints/tall spindle.

Let me ask, more camber in a turn...camber gain,,,,etc etc. Why would you want that, for racing? I think many street car owners get lured into this when they have no intention on autocross or other forms of competitive racing, stock, rebuilt suspension is great, for the daily cruiser/car show guy.
 

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Let me ask, more camber in a turn...camber gain,,,,etc etc. Why would you want that, for racing? I think many street car owners get lured into this when they have no intention on autocross or other forms of competitive racing, stock, rebuilt suspension is great, for the daily cruiser/car show guy.
I agree - the stock suspension is fine for a daily cruiser/car show guy. However, if you're going to drive your car hard on twisty roads, correcting the front end geometry pays a lot of dividends.

The Guldstrand mod, tall ball joints or tall spindles improve the camber curve for first generation F bodies. Improving the camber curve has the important effect of maintaining a larger tire contact patch when the front end is loaded in a turn. Maintaining a larger tire contact patch in turn both improves the speed you can carry through the turn and saves the tires. Take a look here at the tires on a '68 Camaro that ran at Streets of Willow, with no camber correction:



Here's the same car from a distance:



Now look at two cars with camber correction:


and the car above without:



Notice how the top of the front tires on the cars with camber correction are tucked much farther into the wheel well than on the car without camber correction? That translates into speed and safety.

So, if you're cruising to a show, there's no need to do anything to the front end; if you're driving your car hard anywhere - street or track - fixing the front end can both improve the handling of the car and save a lot of money in longer tire life. The chunking in the pictures above is simply an accelerated version of improper tire wear over several thousand miles.
 

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No, they don't have similar corrections done to them similar to the G-mod unless they also include tall ball joints. They may build in more caster, and as a result of that additional caster have slightly more camber in a turn, but they do not provide camber gain like the G-mod/tall ball joints/tall spindle.
First of all, I will say that I don't know much about this subject. I will however point out in this picture of a DSE control arm, you can see how it offsets your spindle. Just as the guldstrand mod does. (moves your stock upper arm). I would call this similar !



I do not know what type of ball joint they use.

I was simply giving another option to doing the g-mod.

As said for 90% of the people, stock is fine.
 

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First of all, I will say that I don't know much about this subject. I will however point out in this picture of a DSE control arm, you can see how it offsets your spindle. Just as the guldstrand mod does. (moves your stock upper arm). I would call this similar !



I do not know what type of ball joint they use.

I was simply giving another option to doing the g-mod.

As said for 90% of the people, stock is fine.
Offsetting the spindle is caster, not camber gain. The important thing the G-mod does is lower the UCA mounting point, which creates more camber gain. The movement of the UCA mounting point rearward (which is what the DSE UCA does) simply allows for more caster, or more caster with fewer alignment shims.

Take a look here:
http://www.camaros.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1175562&postcount=13
http://www.camaros.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1175820&postcount=20
http://www.camaros.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1175958&postcount=28
 

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You guys are going to talk me into doing that dang G mod. Took a buddy up through Caesar's Head this weekend and he said "Holy crap. This thing has no roll and doesn't break loose. As good as you've got it handling I don't know why anyone would spend all that extra money on xxx stuff." The G mod must be the crown jewel to doing good springs, fat anti-sway, good shocks, good bushings, and good tires.

How does it affect tire life for a car that sees mostly normal roads but likes to burn up the mountains on the weekend? My tires can't be rotated.....



 

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How does it affect tire life for a car that sees mostly normal roads but likes to burn up the mountains on the weekend? My tires can't be rotated.....
I think tire life will depend more on your static alignment than the G-mod or equivalent. I haven't noticed any increase in tire wear, and certainly no extra wear on one side of the tire versus the other.
 

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Tire wear is significanly better with the G-mod in many cases where more than just cruising is involved. Outside tire wear was a real problem on mine for years due to positive camber gain. The G-mod, combined with a -1* static camber, has shown to be a good compromse.

I agree with Mike. Without a change in either the spindle height or the position of the upper control arm mounting location, significant change in the camber gain is not going to happen. Taller spindle, taller balljoint, or relocated upper mounting location will get it done.

Oh, and don't make Mike whip out his ACH map. 66 miles of fun, but unfortunately closed due to the fires.
 

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I believe I saw somewhere on Dave Pozzi's site or his response here in the forums that a quality upper control arm and tall ball joint is a good option if you do not what to do the g-mod. Maybe check with David but I am thinking of doing this since I already have DSE arms.
 

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Oh, and don't make Mike whip out his ACH map. 66 miles of fun, but unfortunately closed due to the fires.

Ha! Bring it on. I did some cruising up in Castaic several years ago and almost lost a rental car.

You need 64 miles? We've got this one. Sometimes seems like at least one or two motorcycle deaths every weekend but what can you do?



 
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