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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Does anyone have some suggestions on how to take care of starting your car after it has been run for a bit, then stopped and the starter gets heat soaked? I have a 454 in a 69 camaro with headers. I have used the heat shield, run a remote starter solenoid(as suggested in the reference section), installed a new gear reduction starter, new battery and cables and still can not drive anywhere, run into the store for 10 minutes, then come back and start the car. It will jump start, so at this point, I am looking to install a second battery. Any other ideas?

thanks
Dean
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Good point KZ. I am running the mallory unilite dist that does not have a vacuum advance on it. What would you suggest for static timing?

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Dean
 

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If you can jump start it heat soak of the starter is not the problem. It sounds like you have either battery or cable problems check your grounds they are the most common cause of problems like you have. If it is kicking back when you try to start it then check the timing.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Oger, the battery and cables are new. I have the battery grounded at two locations, block and frame, for good measure. I have checked to make sure the grounds have good connection to metal. In the morning or after it has set for several hours, it will crank right up. This is why it perplexes me. The battery I put in was rated at 780 cold crank amps. I also had the alternator checked to make sure it is charging correctly. So, I am still puzzled. Any other ideas???

Dean
 

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Dean,

I have taken a simple toggle switch and installed it inbetween the + (HOT) wire to the coil so that when I start my car I get the engine turning over and then hit the switch to turn the ignition on. I do this because I run alot of initial advance timing.

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TONY
67 CAMARO R/S CLONE, 355/turbo 350, 200hp NOS,12 bolt,etc...
 

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I'd say Oger is on the right track, place voltmeter across battery terminals, observe cranking voltage while cranking for max 15 seconds.

If less than than 10 volts, get a bigger battery. If not less than 10 volts, replace cables with welding cable, 2/0 AWG. Also, right after cranking, feel with hand all connections for heat. When you feel heat, that is the bad connection, either dirty, or too small in size( not enough contact area).

Another idea, engine cold, take beam torque wrench and measure how much to turn other and compare to heated condition, could tell alot right there. Set initial timing for 6-8 deg BTDC.

Everett 68/350/PG/11.90/115mph
 

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A couple of quick thoughts I learned from a car I had do this. First, the starter in the car was a rebuilt "cheap" unit from Checker. When replaced with the best that NAPA has to offer, problem gone. Second, look at the post on the starter that the cable from the battery attaches to. Most have a nut that screws down right next to the starter, then the battery cable goes on and then a second nut goes on top to secure the cable. Sometimes, the first nut next to the starter itself will work loose causing a poor battery connection and giving you fits. This problem is such a pisser, I hope you get it figured out. For whatever reason, the starter is not spinning fast enough to get the motor started.
 

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As far as starters go, I'm having real good luck with an AC Delco heavy duty starter. It's got a lifetime warrenty, I've already replaced it 3 times no quesions asked. I feel kind of bad about replacing it that much becuase it was never the starters problem. First time I was trying to start the car without the driveshaft in it and it was grinding on the flyweel, so I exchange it, nothing changed, finally figured out what is was. The second time I had my distrubutor a tooth off, engine was kicking back, exchange starter, same problem, finally figured it out. As you can tell when I have a starting problem I imedialtly change the starter, good thing I got one with the lifetime warrenty,
.

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68 468 700R4, and here it is;
mutert23
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
I just put a new starter on mine as well. It is a gear reduction starter that I ordered from JC Whitney. It is made by "Mean Green"? I think that is what it was called. However, I don't even have a dozen starts on this yet. I had the same problem with the AC Delco starter that was on it. This weekend I will try what was suggested regarding checking the voltage. I will recheck all my connections as well. You never know. I know I could possibly throw bigger gauge cable at this, but is this just covering up a problem? I currently have all new #4 cable on the car. This is baffling.
 

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Is the battery in the trunk if it is you will need large cables like the previous posts said welding lead works well. I have always run a ground lead too have never had much luck using the body as a ground strap
 

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Dean,

No. 4 cable is too small. I don't think any thing is wrong with the starter, however ,I could be wrong.

Using the voltmeter, check the voltage between the bat POST and the BAT post on the solenoid, should be less than 1 volt loss. same with ground, go from starter body to battery neg POST, not he cable clamp in either case.

You're looking to carry 200 amperes of current with a cable only capable of carrying 125 amps. Measure across the remote solenoid large terminals to make sure the internal switch isn't carboned up from arcing, remember the major current load? now imagine an arcing, kindda like a dc welder, same would go for the starter solenoid.

I'm sure you've thought of removing the remote solenoid just to be sure the problem isn't there....

Good luck, might even need a larger capacity battery, say 900-1000 cca

Everett 68/350/PG/11.90/115mph
 

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I say try Tony's (Idoxlr8) trick with the kill switch. I heard this works. I have this kill switch on my Z/28 but I don't have the heat soak problem. The previous owner installed it to allow pumping up oil pressure before actual ignition and start. Without spark to the plugs the engine "free wheels" at a high rate and then the switch is flipped and vroom vroom. This doesn't solve the heat soak problem but I think the engine will crank with a hot starter better without spark to the plugs as there is less resistance because no "explosions".

I am thinking of doing this to my 70SS Chevelle because I have this heat soak issue in my big block also. First I am trying a high torque starter that I bought from Summit. If that don't work...time for the kill switch.

R. Stacho (a.k.a. Mytmouse)

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67 SS 396 Chevelle 350HP 4speed
70 SS 396 Chevelle 350HP 4speed
68 RS Z/28 302 350+HP? 4speed
 

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What is your compression. I replaced the starter and cables on my 12 to 1 small block and it would turn over real slow only when hot. I could disconnect power to the distributor with no effect proving it was not ignition advance. The battery load checked good at Auto Zone, but it was only about a 700 cold crank amp battery. I installed a 1000 cold crank amp battery and no problems in a year. Your battery seems a little small for a big block to me.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Chris, This is the direction I am leaning, but getting the extra capacity thru a trunk mounted battery. I would be using one battery to run all the electrics of the car and the trunk mount battery for the stereo stuff, but run them in conjuntion via remote starter solenoids, to start the car(along with putting on bigger battery cables).

Dean
 

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Bilydean, I have run battery pairs for many years in cars and boats connected exactly as you say. One for starting and one for accessories. The two can be paralleled for charging with a solenoid activated by the ignition switch, but do NOT use a starter solenoid. They are not rated for continuos duty and will overheat. The coil draws way too much current. What you need is a low current coil, continuos duty solenoid. You can get such an item from a shop that services semi's. I get mine from a Motorola two way radio shop. The Motorola part number is 5900851519. It only draws about .2 amps, will switch 80 amps and will handle 200+ amps once pulled in. The Motorola one is intrinsically safe in explosive atmospheres. That's why I use them in IO boats. I would still use a 1000 cold crank amp battery for starting your big block.
 
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