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Discussion Starter #1
Have any of you installed the DSE Coil Over conversion, and how smooth was the install? I refer to the conversion that removes the factory upper A-Arm mount and replaces it with Coil Over mount and Improved Geometry Mount points for your upper Control Arms. Thanks.
 

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I just installed QA1 Coil Overs and Global West control arms in my 68. I haven't driven the car yet since I'm doing other mods while I have it pulled apart, but this upgrade doesn't require any frame cutting or mods at all. Just pull out the old and bolt in the new. Any reason why you wouldn't go this route? The GW tubular control arms also have an improved geometry compared to original. Just enough to improve the handling noticeably and keep the car streetable.

Truthfully, you shouldn't go overboard in changing the front end geometry. True you can get better handling out of these kits that require the cutting and welding, but you WILL eat up more tires especially if you plan on street driving the car much.

If you're planning on racing only, have a good budget for tires and need every bit of handling improvement you can get, then go for it and cut/weld away.

Tim
 

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Originally posted by Meanchicken:
I just installed QA1 Coil Overs and Global West control arms in my 68. I haven't driven the car yet since I'm doing other mods while I have it pulled apart, but this upgrade doesn't require any frame cutting or mods at all. Just pull out the old and bolt in the new. Any reason why you wouldn't go this route? The GW tubular control arms also have an improved geometry compared to original. Just enough to improve the handling noticeably and keep the car streetable.

Truthfully, you shouldn't go overboard in changing the front end geometry. True you can get better handling out of these kits that require the cutting and welding, but you WILL eat up more tires especially if you plan on street driving the car much.

If you're planning on racing only, have a good budget for tires and need every bit of handling improvement you can get, then go for it and cut/weld away.

Tim
Why would the DSE kit cause more tire wear? The QA1 setup is simpler because it just replaces the stock spring and shock with a coilover shock/spring arrangement. I have heard of some issues of lower mount problems on these because you use the original lower shock mount which wasn't designed to support any weight to now hold up the car (unless they've changed that).

The DSE setup puts the position and angle of the shock/spring in a better location which is fully braced and able to control the wheel movement much better. Not sure how that's going to create more tire wear; that'd be determined by how you set the alignment.

Jody
 

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LOL Jody! I'm looking forward to Tony's book.

The DS&E mod is something that I'm interested in as well. I'm still looking into different options for the complete chassis, be it DS&E, GW, Due, HTH, leafs, etc.

Greg from HTH e-mailed me and let me know that they are working on using ovalized tubing for the exhaust, to get it to dump at the rear.

I think I'd be very happy with the DS&E tubular/coilovers in the front and the HTH kit in the rear.
 

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Scott,

That would be a very nice setup! I just got off the phone with Kyle at DSE and was asking about the Mule setup. I knew he was working on a kit, but he's making some packaging changes and is a little ways off. He said with the DSE a-arms, bushings, and coil overs up front that I have, along with his rear springs and Koni shocks this car will be as good as I'd ever need. Since all the mini-tub, cage, and rear alterations are already done, I don't want to cut it up some more for these other rear suspensions.

Bottom line, you'll be tricker than me! :D

Jody
 

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Grief? You mean about buying Tony's book? No way was that meant as grief. Tony is writing a fully illustrated book (actually just finished) about pro-touring mods, performance gains, different applications, options, EFI, yadda, yadda... I'm looking forward to the book, and I guess I went a little overboard. :D

And to answer your question, no, I haven't done the DSE mod. Yet. I don't want to start any chassis mods until I have a clear picture of exactly what I want.
 

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You "Pro-Touring" guys are all the same, you can't just leave well enough alone can you? :D

Actually, I have a set of Kyles Uppers coming in the next week or too....


Now, If you two could just move a little further East...LOL....
 

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Why would the DSE kit cause more tire wear? The QA1 setup is simpler because it just replaces the stock spring and shock with a coilover shock/spring arrangement. I have heard of some issues of lower mount problems on these because you use the original lower shock mount which wasn't designed to support any weight to now hold up the car (unless they've changed that).

Jody,
I honestly don't know enough about the DSE kit to tell you if it would wear tires any quicker than the bolt on Global West/QA1 arrangement or others like it form Heidts, Fatman, etc.

I installed both upper and lower GW tubular control arms. The lowers are made to accept the QA1 coil overs and position them properly. I wouldn't even think of bolting coil overs to a stock lower A-arm. I basically yanked the entire front suspension out and am replacing it with modern improved stuff. Looking forwar to experiencing the respons from my 2 turn LtoL GNX power steering box. The old manual one gave me arms like an ape.
My point was not really directed at the DSE kit, I'm sure by the enthusiasm, that DSE's product is very good. It was directed at going too far in upgrading a car intended for street use by cutting the frame up. For street driving and occasional competition, the bolt on alternatives available would most likely suit most enthusiasts. Well engineered bolt on upgrades are also easier to reverse if a person finds they didn't get what they bargained for...or got more than they bargained for.

To counter the statement that tire wear is only determined by alignment, this is not true. For example, a taller spindle will also cause your tires to wear at a higher rate. Geometries of a race suspension are different in many ways than one that is intended for street use. Modifying suspension geometries changes caster camber curves, changes alignment specs and race geometries add up to tires melting away at a higher rate, but gives improved corner carving response.

I think that all of us who are into the Pro touring upgrades for our 1st Gens are after improved handling so we can enjoy the pro touring life, and there are many options available, but you could easliy over do it and come out with a wicked handling machine that chews tires at a rate that would require water cooling on your ATM card. Same is true of the straight line drivers. Do you need a 4-link rear suspension and full tubs for street applications? Nope...but it looks wicked and if you have the power to take advantage of the improved straight line traction you get, then the $7,000 expense (before rim's and tires) is gonna pay dividends in the bracket races.
I'm hear to learn, so let me now if you think I'm under the influence...
: )
Tim
 

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Tim,

I interpreted your first post incorrectly; I thought you meant that the DSE kit (which requires cutting and welding) would increase tire wear by itself, and thought the only way that was going to happen with just that change would be to use an aggressive alignment spec.

I don't think you're under the influence! :D

Jody
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Green Hornet, you are not lying, CamcoJB has some of the sweetest rides I have ever seen and I am just trying to get one going. Everything on his car is first class.

Very Cool. He's the kind of rich guy I want to be when I grow up.
 

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Jody,

You know a little about my car. What kind of difference do you think I would notice if I went with the DS&E coil over kit vs my current set up. DS&E uppers with Hotchkis two inch drop coils and Bilsteins.

thanks

bob spears
 
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