Team Camaro Tech banner
121 - 140 of 174 Posts

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
6,178 Posts
ya - Thats what I was thinking. I just use a funnel and squeeze the top hose. DO we think that would cause these Issues? I don't have a special setup but I don't mind getting one if it will help?
Raise the front end and bring it up to temperature with the cap off. Squeeze the upper and lower hoses and see if it burps. The funnel i listed seals to the radiator and gives you another several inches of fill height.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Willy68

·
Registered
Joined
·
709 Posts
Discussion Starter · #122 ·
I will 100% raise the car and try to fill / burp it. If the fix is that simple I will be ecstatic... Its worth a shot

I may get that Funnel set order to make this a bit easier in the future. Lets see how it goes tomorrow
 
  • Like
Reactions: Willy68

·
Registered
Joined
·
709 Posts
Discussion Starter · #123 ·
That was a FAIL - and I am lost as to what to do next? I jacked up the car - ran it and topped it off, then let it cool and topped it again before I drove it

It was 89 degrees outside during this test drive.
I drove hwy and back roads to the interstate. By the time I hit the Interstate it was @ 210.
I drove 6 miles on the interstate and it stayed at 210-212.
When I got off the interstate and drove home threw the City and on the Hwy it was around 215-220.
When I drove a little spirited the Temp Shot up 20 or so degrees and then slowly came back down.
Once I got home I let it Idle while in drive for a few moments to simulate traffic and it went up to 245 rather quickly.
I also checked the temp with fans running and key on vs engine running and there was a 30 degree difference.

Correct me if I am mistaken but it seems like Not only are these fans not close to keeping up butt this 1.25" tube Radiator is no better than the Northern I have with 1" tubes???

I am thinking of buying another temp gauge and compare it to the one in there now?
maybe something like this just to test it? Allstar Performance ALL80096 Allstar Performance Gauges | Summit Racing
But I think that's just wishful thinking at this point?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
6,178 Posts
Did you bring it up to temperature with the cap off and squeeze the hoses to burp it once the thermostat had opened?

Is the lower hose hot?

Don
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
709 Posts
Discussion Starter · #125 ·
Did you bring it up to temperature with the cap off and squeeze the hoses to burp it once the thermostat had opened?

Is the lower hose hot?

Don
Yes Sr.

Just spoke with Travis from Cold Case. Going to try and get with a local shop to verify a few things - He also thinks this gauge is suspect.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
6,178 Posts
Yes Sr.

Just spoke with Travis from Cold Case. Going to try and get with a local shop to verify a few things - He also thinks this gauge is suspect.
A defective gauge doesn’t explain the temperature increase from the previous setup to this one. I have some real doubts about those coldcase fans. Would be interesting to measure how much current they are drawing.

Don
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
709 Posts
Discussion Starter · #127 ·
A defective gauge doesn’t explain the temperature increase from the previous setup to this one. I have some real doubts about those coldcase fans. Would be interesting to measure how much current they are drawing.

Don
I think the Gauge is failing - I think its super inconsistent. I 100% think these fans are Not cutting it. When I spoke with the guys from coldcase they said the fans would pull less than 10 amps (like 6-7) which also dose not seem correct but, I can get my Amp Clamp and check that this weekend!


feels like a few things going wrong at the same time
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
6,178 Posts
I think the Gauge is failing - I think its super inconsistent. I 100% think these fans are Not cutting it. When I spoke with the guys from coldcase they said the fans would pull less than 10 amps (like 6-7) which also dose not seem correct but, I can get my Amp Clamp and check that this weekend!


feels like a few things going wrong at the same time
That current draw says it all. Those are toy fans if that really is the current consumption.

Don
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
709 Posts
Discussion Starter · #130 ·
That current draw says it all. Those are toy fans if that really is the current consumption.

Don
I also agree about the fans.... I questioned them when I purchased them and they assured me they would work. That's only 1/2 the issue right now though
 

·
Registered
1969 Camaro SS 427
Joined
·
14 Posts
I also agree about the fans.... I questioned them when I purchased them and they assured me they would work. That's only 1/2 the issue right now though
Arkangel77 - As you saw by my new post last night, this is the exact same issue I'm having with the Cold Case radiator and dual electric fan set up. And, Travis at Cold Case is who I've been dealing with as well. It is SO frustrating! I'm going to see how the new water pump with bypass hose works, but I have a feeing it's the fans and shroud as well. At least that's most of the issue. If so, that's so frustrating that it's sold as a kit and is causing all these issues. I'm curious to see what you figure out.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,060 Posts
Arkangel77 - As you saw by my new post last night, this is the exact same issue I'm having with the Cold Case radiator and dual electric fan set up. And, Travis at Cold Case is who I've been dealing with as well. It is SO frustrating! I'm going to see how the new water pump with bypass hose works, but I have a feeing it's the fans and shroud as well. At least that's most of the issue. If so, that's so frustrating that it's sold as a kit and is causing all these issues. I'm curious to see what you figure out.
Yep, I think even if you fix the fans with higher powered ones, that shroud is a no go, it's just going to block a huge amount of airflow on the highway. It's just hard to imagine anyone designing such looks like a very capable radiator and killing it with a shroud and fan set up like that, what were they thinking? It's like making a superstar runner compete in a race breathing through a straw and expecting a great result.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
709 Posts
Discussion Starter · #134 ·
Arkangel77 - As you saw by my new post last night, this is the exact same issue I'm having with the Cold Case radiator and dual electric fan set up. And, Travis at Cold Case is who I've been dealing with as well. It is SO frustrating! I'm going to see how the new water pump with bypass hose works, but I have a feeing it's the fans and shroud as well. At least that's most of the issue. If so, that's so frustrating that it's sold as a kit and is causing all these issues. I'm curious to see what you figure out.
I could not sleep last night thinking about this stuff. I have a few things to try but I really believe the fans are the issue.
Go back stock
I never had any Stock stuff to go back too
 

·
Premium Member
1968 Camaro LS3 TH400 Moser 9” DSE mini tubs
Joined
·
921 Posts
Not to repeat, or overstate….
( I’m not applying for the job of Captain Obvious)
If you had an 18” mechanical fan with a properly positioned shroud…that would probably solve this problem.
So….. Buy a tool to measure the air flow in front of the radiator
HoldPeak 866B Digital Anemometer Handheld Wind Speed Meter for Measuring Wind Speed, Temperature and Wind Chill with Backlight and Max/Min https://a.co/d/5xIlrBA
It only quantifies the assumptions , with real data.
Then your going to decide on a fan ( 18-19”)
It’s been stated by an expert that current is proportional to work being done. That’s why that 18” fan has the 4 AWG sized conductors.
You can only hope the shroud is effective and efficient while parked and while driving.
I looked at the old Chevy dually radiators 1973-198?
They were only about an inch taller and a little wider
So they have slightly more surface area, but they had high pitched fans that move massive air ( we have all heard that HP sucking fan drown out the engine)

You might try running water over the radiator while idling at temperature, but it’s not scientifically going to prove anything…..it just tells you that the problem is heat energy removal. I would be concerned if I could not achieve whatever the thermostat temp is, with this method….and if you couldn’t….you have a problem no fan will ever solve.
I always reserve the right to be wrong and exercise that right far to often 👍
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
709 Posts
Discussion Starter · #136 ·
Not to repeat, or overstate….
( I’m not applying for the job of Captain Obvious)
If you had an 18” mechanical fan with a properly positioned shroud…that would probably solve this problem.
So….. Buy a tool to measure the air flow in front of the radiator
HoldPeak 866B Digital Anemometer Handheld Wind Speed Meter for Measuring Wind Speed, Temperature and Wind Chill with Backlight and Max/Min https://a.co/d/5xIlrBA
It only quantifies the assumptions , with real data.
Then your going to decide on a fan ( 18-19”)
It’s been stated by an expert that current is proportional to work being done. That’s why that 18” fan has the 4 AWG sized conductors.
You can only hope the shroud is effective and efficient while parked and while driving.
I looked at the old Chevy dually radiators 1973-198?
They were only about an inch taller and a little wider
So they have slightly more surface area, but they had high pitched fans that move massive air ( we have all heard that HP sucking fan drown out the engine)

You might try running water over the radiator while idling at temperature, but it’s not scientifically going to prove anything…..it just tells you that the problem is heat energy removal. I would be concerned if I could not achieve whatever the thermostat temp is, with this method….and if you couldn’t….you have a problem no fan will ever solve.
I always reserve the right to be wrong and exercise that right far to often 👍
Great Minds (Maybe lol) I had thought of water on the radiator to see what the result was - Could confirm the Gauge and as you said confirm if heat removal as an Issue?
My Next step will likely be the Monster fan. Just trying to eleminate any other possible option. Pulling plug ti check them / tweaking carb and trying to get it Dyno's so I can have the Air/Fuel Mix verified
 
  • Like
Reactions: Worn Out Welder

·
Premium Member
1968 Camaro LS3 TH400 Moser 9” DSE mini tubs
Joined
·
921 Posts
Yes, It’s important to make sure timing, vacuum advance, carburetor adjustment, etc are all optimal.
I’m not real bright, so I look at what the engineers do, why they do it, and can I get close enough to make my junk work….without limping like a three legged dog🤪
Some of the stuff I see
( a single 16” fan with a 1” shroud ) and 12 AWG wires might cool a bone stock low hp 327 under ideal conditions ( like 60* air temperature)
It’s going to be 107* in Texas today. I’m not sure that Lincoln Mark VIII fan would keep this LS3 at 195 for 40 minutes like it did at 97*.
Then add the A/C heat load and I’m reasonably certain
I’d be looking at that VA 18” brushless too!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
855 Posts
I'm gonna throw out a couple of suggestions out there if I was in your predicament, first off I would send the fans back to CC for a credit if possible and use your existing shroud with some Spal components.
2-12" fans:
Add flaps:

Or I would send the fan/shroud combo back and just get the Spal fan/ shroud combo:

I have this Spal shroud/ fan setup on my LS engine/ with no air cond.and the temp stayed at 203 degrees on a 94 degree day in stop and go traffic.
Hood Motor vehicle Car Automotive design Vehicle

If you look at Dewitts radiator site they use this fan setup on their BBC setup.

I can't run a PWM controller with my ECM and that's okay......when the fans go I'll just replace them down the road. Haven't had any issues with them turning on while I am utilizing the correct gauge wiring and relays, alternator.

Not to knock CC rads but I think you guys are paying too much for what I believe are made in China radiators, I use one from this company(China made) for around half the price, welds are nice and it works okay.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
709 Posts
Discussion Starter · #139 ·
I'm gonna throw out a couple of suggestions out there if I was in your predicament, first off I would send the fans back to CC for a credit if possible and use your existing shroud with some Spal components.
2-12" fans:
Add flaps:

Or I would send the fan/shroud combo back and just get the Spal fan/ shroud combo:

I have this Spal shroud/ fan setup on my LS engine/ with no air cond.and the temp stayed at 203 degrees on a 94 degree day in stop and go traffic.
View attachment 293372
If you look at Dewitts radiator site they use this fan setup on their BBC setup.

I can't run a PWM controller with my ECM and that's okay......when the fans go I'll just replace them down the road. Haven't had any issues with them turning on while I am utilizing the correct gauge wiring and relays, alternator.

Not to knock CC rads but I think you guys are paying too much for what I believe are made in China radiators, I use one from this company(China made) for around half the price, welds are nice and it works okay.
I tried the CC based off of the specks (core size) and the warranty. Only problem with the fans you recommended is they are too deep. I can't fit them.
 

·
Premium Member
1968 Camaro LS3 TH400 Moser 9” DSE mini tubs
Joined
·
921 Posts
I read a white paper….lots of mental gymnastics.
I also realize that a anemometer may not get you as much usable data as I assumed ( we all know about assuming) but it might be better than licking your finger and feeling the air moving….
Mikes thread has a lot of good information and questions asked…the interesting thing was on pg 67
Where it’s stated as insignificant effect of the gap between condenser and radiator.
Just throwing this in there…..while I’m not really contributing ✌

 
121 - 140 of 174 Posts
Top