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Discussion Starter #41
Looks like you have about the same amount of clearance as I do with my Dynatechs. Probably the photos with a finger width of clearance have manual steering boxes. Mine are close to the PS box but don't hit it.
Wow that is interesting. I will try the gasket when I can get some garage time again and see if it hits then. If not I might, might being the key word, move forward and finish hooking things up to see if I can get the car started...
 

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Discussion Starter #42
Thats crazy your'e having such an issue getting a set of headers. those heads are either real fat or like you mentioned a engine mount issue.
I don't recall.., are the engine mounts marked with the p/n# ? I can look at mine with the inspection camera tonight if they are,to check my p/n#s
I have very acceptable clearance around my dynatech headers. as my picture on post #18 shows
I do not know about the motor mounts but the frame mounts do. I might have to get out to the garage and look at the big block motor mounts I have there and see if they have a number on them.

Mike
 

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Discussion Starter #43
I do not know about the motor mounts but the frame mounts do. I might have to get out to the garage and look at the big block motor mounts I have there and see if they have a number on them.

Mike
I looked at the motor mounts I have on the shelf and they do not have any marks to ID them.
The Frame mounts that connect to the motor mounts do have numbers on them.
Mike
 

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Discussion Starter #44
Ok finally got some garage time and with the gaskets and them bolted down they are resting on the power steering box.
BTW here is another thread that shows the space another person had with the dynatech headers.

Now I am checking with a friend who does some welding if they think the welds are too close to bend the one pipe in a bit. The green lines are my markers for where I would need to place the dent but the dent would be closer to where the tape measure is. Since they are stainless steel it might be pretty tough to get a clean dent.
265604
 

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No way to grind enough material away from the PS box to provide clearance?
 

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On my 1st purchase of Dynatech stepped headers on my abc with per steering my header was right against the box. I called their tech line and discussed and they said no way it should hit. After exchanging pictures that showed interference I asked them to send me a new driver side header. That one fit with about a 1/4 inch clearance. Returned the old one
 

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Sounds like Dynatech is getting sloppy with its manufacturing. I'd think that they'd have jigs so there would be absolutely no variance from one set to another.
 

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Discussion Starter #48
No way to grind enough material away from the PS box to provide clearance?
Unfortunately not. I did grind off a small corner of the box just to see but I think I would have to get pretty deep into the PS box for clearance to be made.

I talked to my friend and he said it wouldn't be an issue to bend it there.

Mike
 

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Discussion Starter #49
On my 1st purchase of Dynatech stepped headers on my abc with per steering my header was right against the box. I called their tech line and discussed and they said no way it should hit. After exchanging pictures that showed interference I asked them to send me a new driver side header. That one fit with about a 1/4 inch clearance. Returned the old one
THAT would be fantastic if that happens to me. I will say after having those headers on and off a few times and testing putting it all together I will say I like these headers. Full length plugs work great, I would guess I could change all plugs in less than 15 minutes. I can put the headers in or take them off in about 12 minutes per side.

If the folks at dynatech can get the drivers side to fit with that much clearance, or even 1/8" then I would be singing their praises.

I will say this entire episode has me wishing to get this one done and driveable and then buy another first gen camaro and start again using the knowledge I gained so far BUT I would keep the front clip off and do multiple install / removals of a stock engine and a couple of after market engines with different frame and motor mounts and try different headers.

I don't think that would be reality.
The best thing for me would be 1) Dynatech coming through for me like that did for you OR 2) a 1/4" dent makes the clearance AND the little bend of the collectors to not hit the transmission cross-member (seems pretty easy to get those to bend a bit)

Thank you for the input!
Mike
 

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Discussion Starter #50
Sounds like Dynatech is getting sloppy with its manufacturing. I'd think that they'd have jigs so there would be absolutely no variance from one set to another.
I have not heard back from them since my 8 Aug email and my 12 Aug follow-up email so I will be calling them tomorrow to see what they will say.
I will for certain reply and let people know what they say and if they are willing to swap a header and see what happens.

Mike
 

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I looked for who I spoke with on tech line but came up blank as it was several years ago. I remember I really had to talk them into sending me another 1/2 set. Once I did they put me in touch with someone in customer service. I paid for the second one then in the package they sent a return accounting number and then I was credit for the old 1/2 set. Good luck
 

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Discussion Starter #52
I have not gone away yet, not until I get some sort of resolution... Right now here is where I stand....
Verification, solidification the motor mounts are correct. If you wish to not read all the part number stuff skip down below the "----------------" lines.

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I'm using this images as my "golden rule":
Using line 5 across with 1969 camaro 302/350 etc. ALL those numbers horizontally across are the same motor mount.
For verification of this and since I am using Energy suspension 3.1117 with is the same type of motor mount as all the rest of those listed (including the 3.1118) Here is a link to the 3.1118 motor mount from energy suspension. Motor Mount - Chevrolet Camaro - 3.1118
On that page there is this comment about the 3.1118: "Replaces O.E. part numbers: 3962740 3990918 3962748 Replaces aftermarket number 2283".
If you refer to the cross reference document you'll see those same #s on line 5 across.

Next my frame mounts (brackets / stands) are 3945507 and 3945508.
Those are on the line also starting with "1969 camaro 302/350" under the GM Frame mounts section.
Another point:
It has (L) for the 3945507 for the left side. Now I have a friend that is pretty smart but likes to debate and at times I think he just does these kinds of things to to mess with people, and he got me doubting myself.
His question: "How can you say Left is drivers or passenger side? You could sit in the car and left is the drivers; you could stand looking at the front of the car and left is the passenger side"
To that answer: We are Left hand drive in the USA so 3945507 goes on the driver's side.

So as far as I am concerned, I have the motor and frame mounts correct for a Chevy small block with a 8" harmonic balancer.
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I have measured the engine across the front, side to side at the horizontal middle of the exhaust ports to see if the engine / heads are wider than "normal" and it measures 18 1/2 inches. This is the same as my old pro topline heads and SBC engine. but I do not have a stock engine to measure to compare it against. Now an important note the old engine they used big block motor and frame mounts and maybe they did because of these types of issues, I do not know but I am determined to make this work with SBC engine, small block frame mount and small block motor mounts.

I am working with Dynatech and it appears making progress to at least ID what might be a cause of the header issue.
Thanks! And until next time!
Mike
 

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Discussion Starter #53
Ok it looks like the standard / stock engine is 18 inches side to side of the heads (measured as above). That means 1/4 on average difference in width "sticking further out" per side.

Options:
-Dent the tube
-Lift the engine, pull the frame mounts, notch them slightly to off-set the engine slightly to the passenger side
-Mill the flange at a VERY SMALL angle to angle the the header in towards the center of the car slightly
The last option I considered during one install because prior to tightening I noticed I got about 1/4" clearance before the bolts where completely tight

So now to consider what to do...

Mike
 

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I've had good luck with Dynatech customer service mounting hardware was missing and they sent out what I needed. Hope they take care of you
 

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Discussion Starter #56
I've had good luck with Dynatech customer service mounting hardware was missing and they sent out what I needed. Hope they take care of you
I would say they were very helpful and nice people to deal with but seems like I am the odd-ball with the wider than normal engine and heads. I talked to a couple of their folks on and off for the last two weeks and it appears the options above are my only options at this time.
So, as it was suggested, thought by you but don't see that post in the thread, I ordered another set and if nothing else it'll cost me shipping costs to return them but I have to see if there is a little change as agitator indicated might be possible. Shoot after lots of discussion a 1/16th of an inch difference in the flange looks like it could cause 1/4 of an inch difference in clearance further down the line so what the hell I've wasted more money on coffee and energy drinks while rebuilding this car....

If they don't fit then a torch and a 3/4" steel rod is in their future as I loosened the engine stand, motor mounts, and engine cross-member and made an attempt on getting things to shift a bit and no go. I would have to actually hoist the engine up about 1/2 an inch to get the frame stands off and then notch them for that option. That isn't what direction I was wanting to go so I think I'll go the dent them option next.

Oh well I have certainly learned a lot and could help other in the future if needed.
September 8th is when I should expect the next set of headers... I guess I'll use the time in between to finish every other part of this car so the headers, distributor, alternator, and plugs will be the only things not done when they show.

Mike
 

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Discussion Starter #58
Ok $40 to return a set of headers WELL WORTH IT!!!!!
I really like the guys at dynatech although they were a little incorrect in the thought that the headers would be same from one set to the next. The first set touched the power steering box, the 2nd set gives just over 1/8" of clearance at the closest point, and even then that is for a VERY small length of being that close. Before I couldn't fit anything between the box and the header tube as they were glued against the PS box, now I can fit the folded cardboard between.
I can not say enough good about the headers though! Full length spark plug clearance by a very good amount, they installed with ease (drivers side from under, passenger side from top), Z-bar works, steering seems to clear everything too.
Now unless something else pops up I should have my car running by the weekend!
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266734


I really hope this helps someone out in the future.
Mike
 

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Discussion Starter #60
Glad that worked for you as it worked for me. Agitator
Me too. Of course I would love to have had the 1/4 inch clearance but with the engine and heads a bit wider than standard I am good enough with the 1/8th inch.
Mike
 
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