[RifRaf]

I’ve been spending a lot of time researching and learning more about obtaining and adjusting Driveline Angles for optimal/vibration free operation (for a mainly street driven vehicle).

A couple things that I learned are…
That you do not have to have equal/parallel transmission and pinion angles (see link below for details).

Some New Thoughts on "Driveline Angles"

After completing a rear end upgrade to my Nova, I’ve come to a new understanding of calculating and adjusting the correct “Driveline Angles” for my vehicle. I wrote-up my new thoughts below... but it's a little lengthy. My prior thinking was you would match the transmission yoke angle to the...

www.camaros.net

And there are some flaws within the TREMEC Driveline Angle App (detailed below).

For the most part, the TREMEC Driveline Angle App works great… but there are a couple of situations where perfectly acceptable driveline angles will show-up as “Unacceptable” results (numbers highlighted in RED) within the TREMEC app.

In the first example, I am going to list the results of my current driveline angles.

When I plug these numbers into the TREMEC Driveline Angle App, I get the following “Acceptable” results.

Now, suppose I do not change any of the above driveline angles as shown in Example #1… but I park my car on a 1° slope (front of car is sloping lower) and retake the same driveline angle measurements. I get the following results.

Even though the measured driveline angles are different in Example #2, you will notice that I get the same results for “U-joint Working Angles” and “Difference of Both U-joint Working Angles” when compared to the results shown in Example #1.

BUT… when I plug the driveline angle measurements shown in Example #2 into the TREMEC Driveline App, I get the following results.

The “Driveline Operating Angle” results are now showing up as RED, even though these are the same exact results that were observed with the Driveline Angles in Example #1.

So… the first “flaw” I noticed is that if the TREMEC app sees opposite angles when comparing the transmission angle to the pinion angle (meaning one up angle and one down angle), it will always show the Driveline Operating Angle as RED (Unacceptable) even if these angles should be acceptable.
The TREMEC app does make a reference to this flaw within the “Results Drop-down Notes”, but it really does not provide much detail (see below – yellow box).

The next “flaw” I noticed is that if the app sees “00.0” anywhere in the results, those results are highlighted in RED (unacceptable), even when the “00.0” is listed under the “Driveline Operating Angle” results.
While it is true that you do not want to see “00.0” for either of the U-joint Operating Angles (Angle 1 and Angle 2 in the App), the “Driveline Operating Angle” results are nothing more than comparing the differences between both U-joint Operating Angles… and a “00.0” result is this area would be idea.

In Example #3, I am going to show a great Driveline Angle scenario…. 3° downward angle of the transmission / 2° downward angle of the driveshaft / and 3° downward angle of the pinion.
Notice that the transmission angle and the pinion angle are equal and parallel… and both U-joint Operating Angles are 1°.

But if I input these results into the TREMEC Driveline App, I get the following results.

And once again, the TREMAC App does make a reference to this result within the “Drop-down Notes”, but it is really not an accurate statement when “00.0” is shown under the Driveline Operating Angle.

Don’t get me wrong… as I still feel that the TREMEC Driveline Angle App is a great resource to use, but I wanted to post this information so that anyone who uses this tool would also understand the App’s flaws and limitations.

 

[Vega$69]

Equal and opposite is the basic rule of thumb. Also need to consider pinion rotation under load and deceleration.

One of the reason I like torque arm as there is almost zero pinion rotation.

 

[RifRaf]

Equal and opposite is the basic rule of thumb

That was my same thought process I had... until recently. I can only speak to my own experience, but I have unequal transmission and pinion angles... but my U-joint working angles are very similar and I have absolutely no drivetrain vibration while driving at any speeds (including highway).

Also need to consider pinion rotation under load and deceleration.

Agreed... My current "unequal" driveline angles will keep the U-joint working angles within better specs while the drivetrain is under acceleration load than if I had set my pinion angle "equal and opposite" to my transmission angle.

But then again... maybe I just got lucky 😀

 

[SoCal805]

My $.02 on the Tremec APP is it reads inconsistent especially with a case on the phone. Without a case though my iPhone 10 edge is round so different measurements depending on how phone is held flat against surface

I find the $5 magnetic angle finder works best and I don't have to hold it so the needle "settles" getting a consistent reading. The "math" part is simple

 

[RifRaf]

My $.02 on the Tremec APP is it reads inconsistent especially with a case on the phone

Agreed. I actually use a digital level with a magnetic base when checking driveline angles and do the math to compute the angles.
I was only using the Tremec App to plug my numbers in and see what the outcome was... that was when I noticed the dependencies within the "Results".

 

[SalimSalim]

Oh, it's hard to provide specific feedback without knowing what your angles are. However, you may check if your angles fall within the recommended range for your vehicle.

 

[IsabelaTany]

It's great to hear that you're taking the time to research your driveline angles for your vehicle. They can have a significant impact on the smoothness of your vehicle. So it's important to get them right. Regarding the TREMEC Driveline Angle App, it's worth keeping in mind that it's just a tool. It may not always provide accurate or complete information in every situation. It's always a good idea to double-check the results of any tool or software with your own observations. Even the most reliable apps, such as those from smartengines.com, require double-checking. But overall, it's great that you're taking the time to learn more about driveline angles. It can be a complex topic, but with the right tools, you can achieve great results.

 

[ridesdirt]

@RifRaf I am glad someone dug deeper into this, and that you did it before I got the idea to...

I agree with @SoCal805 I did get different readings when using my phone and a magnetic base angle finder. The angle finder was dead on consistent, readings were exactly the same every time. The phone was not even close, sometimes varying more than 2 degrees.

I think it may be the phone case too. I have an Apple phone. It is generally an accurate measuring device... ever used yours as a tape measure? crazy!

 

[Worn Out Welder]

This is good insight.
The first time I looked at my situation I was off by several degrees in all measurements.
I had just figured it as my bad luck.
I left it to mess up something else, as I often do.
Then it hit me. Did you check the benchmark?
Well that added a new dimension.
The lift is not level…..
I left the mechanical angle finder for a digital which can be zeroed of the surface you’re on and came up with workable data….I guess the tool was smarter than the operator.

 

[slazisme]

I never had a problem using the Tremec app, just make sure the buttons don't affect your readings. My digital magnetic level allowed a nice and true surface for measuring.
Also you guys know that on your i phones in the Utilities section there is a "measure" heading. In there is a digital level.

 

[SoCal805]

The car not being level is not critical, having the suspension loaded is needed to get accurate DL angle measurements. The math works out the same if for example the car is not "exactly" level.

The biggest issue I have with the phone APP is having to hold the phone "dead nuts" steady (get different reading each time) while pushing the button and you need to take phone out of case, so the edge is flat. Unfortunately, the phone is not magnetic.

I have race ramps (tire cribs) so all 4 tires are equally off the ground....but with larger rear (diameter) tires than front the car is not perfectly level just sitting on ground...nor is my garage floor dead nuts level (slopes slightly towards garage door). The math works out regardless as long as suspension is loaded. You can use a digital angle finder where you can "zero out" at whatever angle your car actually sits...the end math results will be the same though without doing that so I just use a mechanical $5 magnetic angle finder.

 

[TomcatSTL]

Don’t get me wrong… as I still feel that the TREMEC Driveline Angle App is a great resource to use

How you can describe the Tremec App as a great resource when you have pointed out all of these inconsistencies?

I plan on measuring angles this weekend, but I am lacking a reliable understanding of what is good. This app strikes me as bad coding if two of the same results offer up different interpretations.

 

[ilikeike]

Tremec app + a bit of common sense=

 

[RifRaf]

How you can describe the Tremec App as a great resource when you have pointed out all of these inconsistencies?

You're right... my mistake.

 

[slazisme]

For those that don't want to splurge on a 15.00 digital level, here are a few pointers that might help. Depends how big you are but sometimes you can get readings with the car on the wheels, use a magnetic torpedo level as a base. On the balancer and driveshaft. It can help when using an phone when the buttons interfere buy sliding the phone down. I was able to squirm under to read diff yoke.

 

[TomcatSTL]

From Spicer...