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Discussion Starter #1
I'm curious what you fellas think about this situation....

I advertised in TC's Parts Wanted section a few months ago for a matched pair of '186 heads, with dates consistent with my Z28 production. A TC member contacted me with a 'matched pair - same dates' for sale, which was dated close enough for my use. We came to agreement on a price for him to 'deliver' the heads to me -including all shipment costs! I sent him payment in advance! Since he's not a business, he didn't have mechanism for a credit card payment, so I had to send him a M.O... ie. CASH.

A few weeks later, I received ONE of the heads, which he'd shipped in separate boxes at the same time via UPS. After weeks of bugging UPS, they were unable to 'find' the 2nd head.

Bottom Line: The seller insured the two boxes individually, each for 1/2 of the amount paid (this was a huge mistake), as a single head does NOT make for 'half of a matched pair';!

I've volunteered to ship back the head I received at my cost to get my full amount back, OR allow him to find/buy/ a second matching head; his choice. He refunded me the amount UPS paid him (1/2 of what I piad him) and has refused to do more!

I am VERY dissatisfied, as I have only the ONE head, which is useless for my purposes!... and I'm out half the cost of a matched pair he agreed to sell me. Which one of us is being unreasonable? Is there something more I should have done as a buyer to protect myself?
 

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Wow man, who woulda thunk one head would get lost. Honestly, I'm not sure either of you is wrong. Dude you bought from insured both for total of your purchase but you're right, a single head isn't worth half what you paid for the pair. It sounds to me like nobody would've anticipated this happening. My opinion, and that's all it is is an opinion. You and the seller should split the value of the lost head. As it sits now he's whole and you're screwed, and that's not right. You should both share a bit of pain and learn from the experience.
 

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If you're asking the value of 1 186 head it depends on if it has 1.94 valves & pressed studs or 2.02 valves & screw in studs (they came both ways) and the condition of the head. One by itself, to me would be worth around $100-$150. What did you pay for the pair ? Who is responsible is also a good question. If the seller packaged them badly allowing the missing head to break through the box and become separated from it's address label then I'd say he is at fault. How well was the one that did arrive packaged ? At this point he is out nothing since all he gave you was the money he collected from UPS in the insurance claim. You, on the other hand, did not get what you paid for. I wonder if the seller will step up and post HERE with his side of the story....
 

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Always two sides to every story. It would seem that you should be able to return the other head for a full refund unless you instructed him to ship and insure separately. IMO
 

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This is a tough one. A matched pair really isn't worth more than each individual head since you can easily find another 186 head with that date since 186 heads aren't that rare. And I don't believe the assembly line workers made sure they grabbed matched heads when building the engines so you don't really need matched heads but you obviously prefer it. It appears you've both been made whole but I don't see why he wouldn't want to refund you the other head if you are willing to pay to ship it back to him. Have you tried to find another 186 head with your date? It seem a waste of shipping money to send the one you have back and the risk that it could get lost is always there.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
I appreciate the comments above, and what you've all said reflects my own opinions.

I paid him $450 to get me the pair of heads. He refunded $225.

He packaged the heads well, using 'head boxes'. The one that arrived was packaged well, and he said the other was packaged the same. The shipper was UPS, and I've had similar problems with UPS in the past, where they lost 'part' of a shipment... so I've learned to insure every package of a item for the full value of the item to cover one of them being lost. in my opinion, UPS is the worst of all shippers re 'lost items', but they will pay off for the insured amount. The seller didn't properly consider that point. I made more than one offer of several means of 'sharing' the loss, even though he chose the shipper and the insurance method. He refused all of them.
I am considering a lawsuit in small claims court, even though he is 700 miles away from me, in Wisconsin.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Jeff:

Good 186 heads with specific dates are not that easy to find. I've been looking for many months now. I found one pair with one of the heads matching the one I received from him, and the other 3 weeks away, for $300 plus shipping. I volunteered to pay another $100 since I've have gotten another head (that I don't really need) from it, which is why I'd have paid the $100; he would have had to pay $30-50 above what he received from UPS to buy/ship those heads, but he refused that as well.
In short, he had my money, and didn't think he HAD to do anything so he didn't... I think it reflects the honesty and ethics of an individual, and if he doesn't make attempt to 'make it right', I'll have to chalk this up to another case of 'misplaced trust'. Even if I file a claim, and collect, the 'effort' involved will be more than the value I would receive, so the only reason to do it is to 'make a point'.
 

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Gary...What is the date on the single 186 you have now? I have some and a friend has some. Maybe we can come up with one for you.
 

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1. That's why the shipment was insured - Neither party's fault.

2. Why would he take the other head back and give your money back? He was selling them for a reason, and doesn't want to have to try and sell them again.

3. Since you know about UPS, you could have asked the seller to ship via a different carrier.

4. What's there to make right? Misplaced trust? What misplaced trust? Did he ship both heads? Yes he did. You got back 1/2 your payment. What are you going to sue for? Lets see. The deal was for $450. You have 1 head, and he gave you $225 back.

5. Law suit? WTF :sad: :clonk:- It wasn't his fault. It was UPS. What would be the grounds for the law suit? What would you collect? What point would you make?
 

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1. That's why the shipment was insured - Neither party's fault.

2. Why would he take the other head back and give your money back? He was selling them for a reason, and doesn't want to have to try and sell them again.

3. Since you know about UPS, you could have asked the seller to ship via a different carrier.

4. What's there to make right? Misplaced trust? What misplaced trust? Did he ship both heads? Yes he did. You got back 1/2 your payment. What are you going to sue for? Lets see. The deal was for $450. You have 1 head, and he gave you $225 back.

5. Law suit? WTF :sad: :clonk:- It wasn't his fault. It was UPS. What would be the grounds for the law suit? What would you collect? What point would you make?

I agree. Also IMHO, if he had insured each head for the total amount it would have been fraud.
 

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Gary, Post the date. I also have some orphan 186 heads.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
The heads are G31 of '69.

I disagree wholeheartedly above wiht the posters who believe that a 'head is a head'... and that one head is 1/2 of a match pair. Apparently those fellas do not understand what is required to restore a car... for judging. I paid MORE for the matched pair. I have five heads already, but not matched dates for my car.... which is why I paid twice what I would have otherwise.
 

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The heads are G31 of '69.

I disagree wholeheartedly above wiht the posters who believe that a 'head is a head'... and that one head is 1/2 of a match pair. Apparently those fellas do not understand what is required to restore a car... for judging. I paid MORE for the matched pair. I have five heads already, but not matched dates for my car.... which is why I paid twice what I would have otherwise.

NCRS judges the head dates? Did not know they pulled the covers, although the 1 date can be seen through the oil cap hole on 69.
I have a pair of 186 heads off a original 69 350/300hp Corvette and they are F-20-9 & G-3-9, they were original to the car they came off.

The G-3-9 has a space after the 3, wonder if you could JB weld a 1 onto it?

I also have I-13-8, A-3-9, (2)-I-15-9, K-26-9, L-19-9, A-14-0, B-20-0, D-22-0, Also a matched set D-7-9 & D-9-9 .
 

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UPS will let you insure for whatever you state as the value, and charge accordingly. However, if you ever make a claim, they will make you prove your COST.

So, if at my company, we ship freight collect, and the item gets lost or destroyed, they will pay off what the buyer paid for the item (ie. our sell price.) However, if we ship that same item freight prepaid (even if the buyer is paying the freight), they will only pay off what our cost is for that item.
 

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If I sold and shipped someone a set of heads and only one arrived I would offer a full refund if he wanted. It was not the buyers fault and he was buying a matched set of heads. If you think the buyer was made whole by getting half his money back, equate that with what the seller could expect to sell one head for. To tell the guy though luck isn't right.
 

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If I sold and shipped someone a set of heads and only one arrived I would offer a full refund if he wanted. It was not the buyers fault and he was buying a matched set of heads. If you think the buyer was made whole by getting half his money back, equate that with what the seller could expect to sell one head for. To tell the guy though luck isn't right.

I agree 100% and would do the very same had I been the seller, but to claim you are going to take the seller to court because UPS lost the head is just nuts.:sad:
 

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Similar situation happened to me, shipped set of 391 heads, one head arrived right away and other one arrived week later, let me tell you buyer was pretty nervous and I was concerned because I put no insurance on them. UPS came through.
 
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