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Need help with body alignment to frame

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#21 ·
Sometimes a car owner will ask here for reassurance which is understood. The shop doing this work should need no assistance evaluating and solving this problem. When I was in collison and yanking frames, hobby forums were not solicited for aide. The frame techs with whom I am still associated have no reason to ask a forum how to repair a vehicle. It does not matter if it's 2014 Lexus, a 97 F-350 or a 69 Chevelle. The same principles apply.

The shop that poorly attempted to fix your lean was not qualified. They overlooked the evidence of hacked bodywork.

Good luck resolving this issue.
 
Discussion starter · #22 ·
Sauron67MM said:
Sometimes a car owner will ask here for reassurance which is understood. The shop doing this work should need no assistance evaluating and solving this problem. When I was in collison and yanking frames, hobby forums were not solicited for aide. The frame techs with whom I am still associated have no reason to ask a forum how to repair a vehicle. It does not matter if it's 2014 Lexus, a 97 F-350 or a 69 Chevelle. The same principles apply.

The shop that poorly attempted to fix your lean was not qualified. They overlooked the evidence of hacked bodywork.

Good luck resolving this issue.
Click to expand...

In fairness to the body shop doing the work, the first thing they told me when I pointed out the issue was that they thought it had to be something with the suspension that is causing the misalignment. These guys have been very professional all along and are quick to point out all the previous shoddy work. My rationale for coming to this board is that (1) you all seem to know way more than anyone else about these specific cars and (2) to the best of my knowledge none of you have a financial gain if I continue to pay them to fix the old crappy repairs. I expect that they will tell me tomorrow what they feels needs to be done to fix the issue so I want to be as educated as possible so I can make the right decision moving forward.
 
#23 ·
I was looking at the very first picture. Just looking at the springs... it looks like the right side spring is much closer to the fuel tank than the left side spring. Check the rear shackles, make sure they are vertical and straight (they should hang straight down, not offset) from the rear frame.
 
#24 ·
At this point, as previously stated, you are going to have to take out some variables. You know for sure, that you have differences in mount design side to side. Fix that. Without it, you are pissing in the wind. It is hard to diagnose any problem when you have 50 other things all wrong. Get the correct designed parts needed, whether they be original style or aftermarket. You can tell very easily if the rear end is sitting crooked if you measure from front of wheel to quarter panel on both sides as someone else suggested. That will show you some of your problem. I would try to get a mini square and place it on the frame rails in various places and see if they are square to the trunk pan. This is not going to be a great test, (other panels I.E. the trunk pan, you are assuming are square) but if there are big gaps, it could show you if the frame rails are really off. Then start taking measurements from outside of frame rail to trunk drop offs on both sides. You really just need to start measuring everything you possibly can from side to side. Measure and mark center line of the car on the gas tank, and measure each rail to the point. If the frame rails are shoved over, that would explain the axle problem.
 
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#25 ·
Maybe there's something about diffs in these cars I don't know, but have a look at the last pic in post 14 and compare the bottom bolt in the diff cover to the center of the square hole in the body above. Yikes!

Just an opinion, but a 2" block to level the suspension worries me. Remember the suspension has 4 corners. For example, a low front right makes for a high left rear. Mismatched tires/wheels will impact the stance of the car. Just rambling...
 
Discussion starter · #27 ·
So I spent three hours at the body shop yesterday measuring and looking everything over and I think we found the problem. Looks like the frame was bent when the car was "restored" and the nitwits doing the work decided to just weld the body onto the frame rails that were actually about 2" to the left. The body was straight but the frame rails were off. The body shop decided to straighten the rails and when they did the body is now 2" to the right. Weird thing is that the car drove dead straight and tracked perfectly before starting this venture. No pull during driving or braking.

I guess my options at this point are to put the rails back where they were and have the body straight or cut all the welds and move the body to the left onto the straightened rails. So, here I sit, started with a plan to paint the car and now I am looking at possibly cutting the whole damn thing apart. If I go the route of cutting the thing apart, how much work am I looking at? It sounds very ominous to me.
 
#28 ·
Some of what is stated makes no sense regarding unibody construction and repair, or even a full frame vehicle. If the rails were pulled on the frame machine, so was everything attached to them. If the rails got bent when the car was hit, so was the surrounding structure, hence the term unibody. As standard collision repair procedure, cars are pulled prior to part replacement. What I previously posted still stands: All this should have been evaluated prior commencing with repair attempts.
 
#30 ·
Like someone already said; Why isn't the shop figuring all this out, and giving you options, BEFORE they started pulling on it? I understand coming on here and getting opinions from people who have "been there, done that", but why listen to anybody but the experts you are paying to do the work?
 
Discussion starter · #31 ·
jno said:
Like someone already said; Why isn't the shop figuring all this out, and giving you options, BEFORE they started pulling on it? I understand coming on here and getting opinions from people who have "been there, done that", but why listen to anybody but the experts you are paying to do the work?
Click to expand...

I'm here consulting you guys because clearly you have more knowledge and have "been there - done that". To be honest I am beginning to doubt the shop's capabilities at this point. They told me they were lifting the passenger side rail about an inch which I agreed needed to be done. I never approved a side to side pull so they are liable there and need to fix it. It is just amazing to me how these little projects can grow once you peel back the layers. Now I know why so many folks start with the raw shell and work from there.
 
#32 ·
I don't think anyone involved in this car has a handle on what's going on. Talking about frames, bodies, moving rails to fit sheet metal... I screwed a hit and rusted out '67 together with a tape measure, some plumb bobs and a copy of the AIM. It's not as hard as you've made it. Further more, it's damn near impossible to remove a frame rail and spot weld it back on 2" away from where it's supposed to be.

Measure the distance from leaf pad to axle flange on both sides. Then all the cross points given in the AIM. If you're looking for 2", it won't be hard to find.
 
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