Time to go TH400 and GV overdrive!

 

NO!!

I figure a Real Art Carr 200-4R tranny is the way to go unless I can find a reasonably priced STRONG 4-speed once my M-20 goes south.

And I am really concerned about this too b/c of my about 550hp, 496" motor.

Next, I figure a 9" next when my 12 bolt decides to hang it up!!

The guys never got one to live in the long "we will make it live or else" post that I tried to keep alive over the months/years.. Or whatever it's handle was...

pdq67

 

What do you think of Bpw Tie Overdrives 700R4 level 3 700R4?

 

Time to go TH400 and GV overdrive!

I am more interested in the GV unit. Do you have one? Like it?

 

my problem is I'm already setup for the 700R4 so I would like to run another just one built stronger if possible.

 

Don't think you will get one to live!!!

pdq67

 

I had a bowtie 700, I think they are great and you can get them built to handle the power you have. They are on the West coast so shipping shouldn't be too bad. Worth the money in my mind.

 

I have to agree with the others that said NO. I talked to a few tranny builders in the past and they all agreed the 700 is just not a good basis for a high HP build. Of course you will hear some people say how they love theirs and never had a problem. I think in your HP range you have out grown a 700r4 (IMO). You will be better off with a 200-4R, there are aftermarket parts made for them that allow them to be built much stronger than the 700R4.

You should be able to get a 480LE built that will handle your power.

I chose to go with the Gear Vendor and th400 (after tearing up several th350's). I haven't had a problem with my th400. I am willing to give up a few HP for reliability.

Bonzo, Do a search in this section on Gear Vendor, they have been discussed before. If you have any further questions let me know I have been running one for quite a few years.

 

Mike -

Did you talk to your tranny guy? Before you get too involved, you may want to pull the governor out and see if it is damaged. I've had two 700R4 act the way you describe, and in both the governor broke. Mine got sheared because of a small piece of FOD (chunk of aluminum from tranny case), but I suspect they could be broken just romping on it.

 

Well since I already have a 700R4, and a custom rear mount and have shortend my driveline I'm going to try a level 3 700R4 from Bow Tie, maybe if Dennis (djd) is reading this he can give me a little thought as your running a 700R4 behind a 383. How has your luck been?
Thanks,
Mike

 

yeah,dennis.that would be good to know considering i am about to set a 383 in front of a 27 spline with about 3k street miles on it.kind of afraid to ever accelerate at all with all the negative comments lately!
seriously though,i had it checked out after about 2500 pretty hard miles behind a 375 horse 350 and it was in pristine condition.
i know,sometimes you don't see it til it breaks,but i'd also like to know what all you had done to yours and how it's handling the power!
Eric B

 

Hopefully Dennis will chime in here and let us know? This is a moot point now but why are the 200-4R's that much better, I mean the 700 series has been made longer and put in more vehicles, there are many, many more out there yet you can get more custom parts for the 200-4R's? I'm actually going to have my 700 gone through and totally fixed and keep it as a backup, or trading material.

 

It was b/c the Turbo GN Buick guys started to beat h-ll outta the 200's!!! So they got a jump on the 700's is all.

Somebody will eventually step up to the plate and figure out how to make the 700 live. Then, also spend the money to create the parts that will do it.

pdq67

 

There know such thing as a bullit proof 700,your better off with a 350,400 or even a powerglide.You can bullitproof them.

 

Hello,

Check these guys out, they build my tranny's!

http://www.phoenixtrans.com/

Good Luck!

Chris @ www.C-DPerformance.com

 

Another option not mentioned is the 4L80 overdrive. It can be set up to run a standalone computer, is a BEAST in terms of strength (rivaling to TH400 slightly), and would look more tidy IMO than an added on GV setup. Cost would be similar to a TH400 and a GV unit. My Dad owned and operated his own transmission shop from 1971-2000, and his opinion, the 700R4 is killed by torque, not HP. It will not hold up behind even a mild street rat over time because of the torque. Please remember, these trannies were originally used in cars like S10 V6 pickups! Most of the OEM internals are pressed steel or cast pieces, making them not only cheaper to manufacture, but also inherently weaker than their big brothers. Many companies offer forged and hardened clutch drums, and shafts,etc. but it is simply a bandaid approach. Recommendation is 300 Hp or less and small block only for the 700R4 to live, no matter what tweaks are performed. Its a problem of design. The 200 is better in terms of strength, but only marginally. It does feature better real-world first gear than the 700 IMO. (less wild) Go with the 4L80 or TH400 with GV. Its not fun having to baby the car to make the tranny (or any other parts) live, and thats what you'd need to do to keep the 700 alive.

 

I have also learned the 700R4's aluminum hubs with steel shafts are a point of breakage. From what I have learned the 200-4R has many more billet parts available and was never designed to go from s10's to fullsize pickups. What gets me is how do the 700R4's hold up to full size 4x4's?

 

They don't hold up particularly well, actually, and again torque is the enemy. A full size 4x4 still generally used a 350 engine. True the weight of the vehicle causes a bit more strain. A big block or high torque 383 small block 4x4 with 700R4 would not last unless, again it was babied constantly. A couple of aggressive romps would destroy it.

 

I think I read somewhere that the 80 in the 4L80 and E tranny meant 800 pound foot torque capacity!!

I do distinctly remember reading that after the "bean counters" got through with the TH400, it's life went from 250,000 hard miles to 125,000, (well, lets just say), miles!! The article was written by a well respected tranny expert...

This might sound stupid, but I wonder how the Ford and MOPAR 4-speed OD automatic trannies are holding up??? I have read that the 727 and the C-6 are as strong as, if not a bit stronger, then the 400 is...

pdq67

 

PDQ67 thats a real good question. I know I have torcherd the one in my supercharged V10 F 350 4x4 Longbox crew cab. Its lifted with 36" tires so I know its be strained and at the moment its still goingstrong with a 105,000 miles.

 

There are a lot of Parts out there for the 700-R4, you just have to know where to look. Such as for the sunshell there is a hardened upgrade called the beast that is tons stronger than the factory unit. There are billet servos to help clamping forces, manual VB's ect. I have these and many more upgrades and goodies done to my 700 and it is holding up perfect to 550 LBS-ft. of torque in a 70 Chevelle. The trans shifts perfect and works great every time. I am very happy with it.
The problem is just finding the products or more like knowing where to look. I did a lot of research and ended up purchasing from several different vendors. Most of the hard parts and rebuild kit I purchased from www.artcarr.com minus the beast I purchased locally.
These trans in a stock configuration are not the strongest, mine when it was first put in only had a factory rebuild done to it which lasted 3 years before I burned it up with the latest motor. What went in it intiall was the clutches and bands were over powered. After the performance rebuild everything works great.