An LS1 would be nice but expensive. I would suggest a procharged stroker SBC.

 

If I'm not mistaken, there is a build-off between an original 350 cast iron block and an LS-1 in the last issue of Chevy High Performance. I believe the outcome was that both blocks could be made to make comparable hp/tq. You might want to read their article...

 

I saw that same article and would recommend giving it a read. Bear in mind they both started from scratch, but the build price for both was comparable. I think they said the LS1 was about $300 more. But if you already have a motor to start with the LS1 could be much more expensive.

One thing I gathered from the article is that the LS1 made nearly the same power as the SBC build-up, but the LS1 had better street manners. They had to really crank up the volume on the SBC to beat the LS1. The LS1 is hard to beat for a well mannered street motor that makes decent power and torque for the money.

 

the usual arguements are reliability and gas mileage.........is it more of an ohhhhhh look at my ls1 in a 68 camaro factor.....and, i figure my 69 block will be nearly as reliable........

 

I had a 400hp w/700r4 SB in my 69 had no problems with reliability
or anything. But I still enjoyed driving my 2000 ss 6spd car much
more, way way more responsive . Even though the 69 was faster
in the 1/4 mile the 2000 seemed faster. Thats why I sold my 2000
and used the money to put an 05 gto ls2/t56 into my car.
Should be done in a few months. Also if you care I got 15mpg
with the 350 and 21mpg city and 28 hwy with the 2000.
I love the LS motors, drive one and you will see. It's not a weekend
swap though, go on www.ls1tech.com under the conversion section and theres a sticky
with everything thats needed. Good Luck

 

If I was to do my car over, I would get a 350 RamJet crate motor for $5k.

 

If you're going to keep the car for 10 plus years and drive it - there's only one choice - LS1. The SBC is a great ngine, but once you get the LS1 sorted out it puts out more power, with better manners and better fuel efficiency.

 

X2. These LSX engines are awesome. I help a friend of mine build them regularly. I will put one in my Z28 hopefully this winter. I currently have a nice 383 stroker but when I see the performance from these LSX combos and the efficiency for the power I cant help but want one. Mine will be poked and stroked for sure and will probably put down close to 550 at the wheel with ease. Drive it all the time too with good mileage to boot.:thumbsup:

 

If you are happy with the performance of your car now I would just swap in a TKO 5 speed and have fun with it. Then if you crave more power down the line put a nice set of 180-200cc heads on there with an Air gap manifold and enjoy!

 

Am I the only one that thinks the LS motor is butt ugly?
Pop the hood: yawn. Great engine but it looks awful.

I do have to say they are growing on me like a case of morning wood.

Who knows, maybe one day I will step over to the ugly side.

 

Am I the only one that thinks the LS motor is butt ugly?
Pop the hood: yawn. Great engine but it looks awful.............

No you're not the only one.

 

Just out of exp. I love my LT1(except the ignition system). Though my my dad has a SBC350 in his z28 and it puts 450 on the ground but as stated above it has a horrible responce. My opinion; chevy 383 HT turn key.:thumbsup:

 

The LSX has many things going for it. I read that article and it was interesting. However, the build cost was similiar but, in my case, I would have to get new headers, fuel system that would drive the cost.

I just had a 410 gen 1 small block built

 

i may be able to get my hands on a lsx block off a hummer...it needs some work...

 

i may be able to get my hands on a lsx block off a hummer...it needs some work...

I wouldn't start with less than a full pullout, including electronics; unless you're ready to go aftermarket ECU. Piecing together an LSx engine setup is probably the most expensive way you could go.

 

I thought this question over a while ago and decided on a engine that didnt have all the computer and electric stuff on it. Less things to go wrong and easier for me to fix if something goes wrong. So I went for the gas dumping, carborated, classic muscle engine. 383 stroker! I'll let my daily driver be effiecent with all the computer controlled settings.

Just one example I can think of, lets say you drop a stock ls1 engine in for now because thats what your budget allows. Later down the road you got money for a cam and some other goodies. Unless you got the tools and know how to tune the computer controlled engine, your going to have to pay someone to do this for you in order for you engine to be running efficent to meet the new specs. Cost at least $150.

 

Just one example I can think of, lets say you drop a stock ls1 engine in for now because thats what your budget allows. Later down the road you got money for a cam and some other goodies. Unless you got the tools and know how to tune the computer controlled engine, your going to have to pay someone to do this for you in order for you engine to be running efficent to meet the new specs. Cost at least $150.

Let's say your carbed 383 gets 18mpg on the highway and an LS1 gets 21mpg on the highway, all with the same transmission and rear end ratio. (I think that probably UNDERSTATES what the actual difference is.) So at $3.00/gallon it takes 6,300 miles to pay for that tune, and you still have an understressed, 450-500 flywheel horsepower, docile engine.

I understand the costs imposed by going to an LS1 (no ones mentioned the sumped fuel tank, fuel return line, radiator, headers with O2 sensors, place to stick the ECU, etc., etc.), but then you have an engine that will need oil changes and plugs from time to time and is otherwise relatively maintnance free, again while putting out enormous power and being very fuel efficient.

 

Keep in mind this is a magazine with sponsors to promote that did the comparisons. When you read some of the components they selected and the outrageous prices they claim to have paid for some of the stuff you realize how ridiculous some of it is. The prices they printed were way above retail too. We aren't talking exotica here, these are both only 11:1 street motors alot of the exotic pieces are overkill for these mills. Not really sure what their intent was, everyone already knows what the LS1 can do. But I guess it's nice to know you can build a gen 1 to run with it and for a lot less than they did.

 

FYI - those prices for the LS engine and components were sourced through SDPC, Summit Racing, and Turn Key Engine Supply. If you can get a better price - then obviously, go with whoever can save you a few extra bucks; I would and I do.

Also, I'm curious to know what you thought was exotic on the LS? Seriously, there was nothing exotic about it whatsoever - carb'd, non cnc ported heads, etc.

Regards,
H

 

I know this sounds like a step backwards but GM has a distributor adaptor for the LS1 out now so you can run it with a carb and distributor. It would probably put out just as much HP but you wouldn't have to deal with the ugly coil packs. I never did like the plastic covers either. I think a carbed LS1 or 6.0L LSX with a distributor would look pretty interesting in a muscle car. Especially if somebody came out with some finned valve covers to replace the stockers. It would still look old school but with up to date cylinder heads. The front mounted distributor and intake manifold with a valley pan would definitely be unique in a Chevy.

 

if money is not an issue , go with the ls7 427 gm creat motor 13.000.00 add what you need to make it run and you just spent 20.000.00.
rick k

 

Stick with the sbc. I've owned five LS1s and an LS2 and I'm still waiting to be impressed. :boring: A decent engine but nothing more. My warmed over Pontiac 455 impresses me more than any of my LSXs (or my HEMI). Good grief, you can get anything for a sbc and get it cheaper than any other engine. :thumbsup:

 

alrighty then.

Jody

 

Jody that pretty motor is no stock LS, so that really doesn't count. That engine is extremely nice!

The camaro pictured with the LS is UGLY with those coils sticking out, IMO. And why would you put THAT motor in a trailer queen (the 2nd picture)? To each his own.

 

Steve's car is no trailer queen. It sees regular track days. That car is just about all go over show.

I just read the CHP article. I never really buy the costs part, but the crux was starting from scratch, 580 hp, the 15* heads on the LSx make it a lot easier to make liveable HP than the old 23* heads. The builder of the SBC mentioned if they could have used 18* SBC heads, it would have been better. He seemed to think 18* heads would become more common in the future (or at least he hoped).

Plus they seem to regularly run .600"+ cams in those LSx blocks, plus 1.75 ratio rockers. Pull that off in a SBC and make it compeltely streetable.

I guess it is all airflow.

Matt, I'm with you. My 67 has no drivetrain at all. It will be cheaper for me to grab a drivetrain out of a new car/truck and install it vs. going SBC/700R4.

 

I can agree on the LSX looks, which is why the factory used plastic covers on some of them. I opted to do the Hogan intake, but have the rails mounted under the plenum to hide them, plus I'm hiding the coil packs so they are not on top of the engine.

As others have said, the swaps to LSX are getting easier daily with mounts, headers, etc. readily available. If you have the stock computer with it like from a take-out that's great too, as software like HP Tuners is cheap and the factory computer can handle most any combo, including turbos.

Jody

 

I had a 412ci motor that I was going to add a TKO-600 to for $3500. So here's what I did:

1. Purchased LS1 and T56 for $4500 (with ECU, accessories, everything needed)
2. Sold old TH400 for $450
3. Sold SBC for $2900

So the LS1/T56 was $1150 out of pocket, tranny included...I'd be $3500 out to convert the car to a TKO. I came out well ahead. I even modified the wiring harness myself, and I had to buy new headers anyway.

 

Imho, the gist of the article was that if the heads flow the same, both motors will make the same power!!

They had to use a bigger cam in our old motor b/c our heads just DON'T flow as good as the LS-heads is all!!

AND what's doubly bad about this is that GM has heads that equal the LS- heads flow, but NEVER opted to run them that flow like they do now on the LS- engines!!

This what I am carrying on about when I say the GM purposely OBSOLETED the BEST SB in the world when they create the LS- to replace it!

AN LS- engine has more parts, a poorer more tourcherous(Sp?) oiling system as well as a 4-bolt head sealing method that is KNOWN to be worse than a 5-bolt sealing method EXCEPT for port layout packaging!!

And give me a break on the ignition too!!!

H-ll, the OLD 500 Cad had a FAST-BURN chamber on it years ago AND if you bring up that an LS- block is stronger than our old cast-iron blocks, it's ONLY b/c GM cheapened out and poured them out of cheap cast-iron metal b/c a 500 Cad. block is hard as h-ll!!

pdq67

 

I love the old small blocks, but I can't ignore the new LSX potential. All aluminum small block that can be purchased used with low miles and all accessories for less than an old school aluminum block by itself. The heads flow very well out of the box, and when fully ported beat any 23 or 18 degree head I've seen; they flow good enough for a healthy big block.

28-30 mpg on the freeway, very low maintenance, and a ton of power potential in an all-aluminum package. Yes, they have weaknesses, but the 4 head bolts per cylinder are supporting well over 1000 HP in forced inductions. If I was building an all-out forced build I'd opt for an old-style small block with HP goals of 1500-1800 HP. Otherwise, for a street and track setup with 1000 HP or less they do very well with boost.

New technology is not the end of the world, it's actually cool.

Jody

 

I know Jody!

I'm just PO'd at GM b/c they didn't moderize the old block's topend before they put her out to pasture is all.

A set of Buick 10 degree heads shoulda just about did it! And how long have they been available??

pdq67

 

I understand Paul, and 100% appreciate your take on this. For whatever reason they went this direction instead. Kinda makes us "old dogs" learn new tricks so to speak.

A couple years ago I had no interest in the LSX family of engines, but after doing a couple I've changed my mind. Does not mean the old school motor cannot be anything you want it to either, but this is becoming a good alternative to it, with more and more aftermarket things to help the swap.

Jody

 

Tyler, what is that acces. package? Very nice.

 

That's mine! It's a brand new system they are coming out with, should be fully tested and ready for sale around February 07.:hurray:


Jody

 

Scott-

We make the entire front accessory drive for the LSX engines, we call it the Sidewinder.

Tyler

 

Is it on your site?

 

No. We are still in the testing phase, we will offer it for sale after the new year, do you need some specific info on it?

Tyler

 

Nope, just curious, doing homework for the future. I can wait until it's out in the public.

 

Boy did I call the head-bolt deal correct on the LS- engines b/c my new Jan, 2007 issue of CC has on page 22 a pic of a new GMPP LS- block that NOW HAS 6 head-bolts per cylinder!!

AND it's cheap AT $2500 a hit!!!

Oh, you guys don't know how bad I wanna put an LS- motor's topend on an old block!!!!!

Sounds to me like a 4-bolt "better idea" went south along with the cathedral intake ports turning into rect's too!

I'm waiting for them to rework the oiling system NEXT!!! HE, HE!!!!

pdq67