Every 100lbs is worth a 1/10 is what they say so if you can lose some weight that would help espicially off the front end like the sway bar,ot the battery in the trunk.
I would guess dropping the exhaust would be good for a 1/10 or so as well.Traction bars and frame connectors will help the 60' times.
If you have power steering lose the belt it's a 1/10 on my car.You could try running without the hood as well that got me about a 1/2 of a 1/10 last year.

 

Simple, 150 HP shot of N2O.

 

I agree a nice little NOS shot will work,but from my experience, then you need to do something to put the new found boost to the pavement. I suggest traction bars and maybe subframe connectors, just my opinion. There are a lot of good ideas at this website someone will have a good idea or experience.

 

Eric
I would highly recommend getting yourself either CalTrac Bars or the South Side Machine Lift bars. Look into adding decent shock absorber as well. Competiton Engineering makes a servicable piece. I bet you can pick up a tenth in 60' and not touch the motor. You will need to tune your suspension once all these pieces are added, remember to only change things one at a time. All the power in the world is useless if it can't be put to forward motion. Keep us posted.


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Doug Thiel
69SS 355/TH400/9"
http://hometown.aol.com/dddthiel/myhomepage/photo.html

 

Thanks guys for the suggestions. N2O is out of the question though, I am running hypereutectic pistons and don't want to take any chances.

I think the traction bars and subframe connectors will be my next investment. What do you think of my current 1.74 sec 60' times without them though? How much room for improvement just tweeking the chassis do you guys think I can get?

I'm kinda hesitant to pull the sway bar off since I drive it on the street, how bad would it handle without it? When I had it out while rebuilding the front end, it didn't seem that heavy - would it help weight transfer by giving the front suspension more room to travel?

I'll definately try the power steering belt next time out to see if it makes a difference.

Thanks again for the suggestions - please keep 'em coming.

BTW I was out running the car this afternoon and it ran like crap - 12.6's today. Hot with a strong headwind. Oh well. Next week I'll have some things to try.

 

Did someone recommend the DEH cam you have a set of heads with excellent exhaust flow and a good set of headers. The cam may be hurting you it was designed for an engine with a restrictive exhaust. I definately agree with the need of subframe connectors and some sort of traction aids. You can put on the bolt on ones and weld them in that seems to be the easiest.

 

I would suggest stepping up on the cam (solid or a roller). I can tell you that I had (just changed the engine) almost the same exact setup as you are running I ran 12.02 @ 112.66 mph (my car weighs 3400+lbs with me in it and I have 3.42 gears, 26" McCreary tires, 3000 stall). You will be shocked with how big a difference the frame connectors make, if I were you that would be my next step. I'm shocked your 60' is as good as it is without frame connectors or traction bars. My car also really responded well when I switched from the 3310 (vac secondary) to a double pumper. The carb change made the engine much more responsive. My car is a 70 and I ditched the sway bar, my car handles fine without it (I have 3 1/2" rims so it is far from a canyon carver), but at no time has it ever felt unsafe. My car is also lowered which I'm sure helps. I also drive mine to and from the track (I don't own a trailer). My car also responded very well to a open spacer on the Air Gap. My cam is/was a little more aggresive then what you are running, but it is hydraulic flat.

Royce

 

Oger, the DEH cam was my own doing . . . I ran a lot of different cams through desktop dyno and the 275 DEH made the best torque from 2000 up to 5000 RPM. But - at the time I still had 2.73 gears and a 2000 rpm stall, so a broad flat torque curve is what I needed. I agree that a cam change is probably in order, its just a question of what to change to and when Mr. Bush sends my tax refund. lol

What do you guys think about a Crane roller setup: 539 lift I / 558 E, duration @ .050 is 230* I / 238* E. If not the roller, maybe a solid lifter cam like the Crower - 458 I, 468 E, duration 230 I, 236 E - LSA is 112. If my exhaust ports flow real well, should I consider a single pattern cam? If so any recommendations?

After my humbling performance yesterday a few chassis mods alone will probably not get me where I want to be, so a major cam change is something I am now seriously considering. I may not wait to fall to pull the motor for a cam change after all.

I do have access to a Holley 650 DP - Maybe I can borrow it and make a few runs, along with a 1" spacer - don't think I would have room for the spacer long term though, I don't have a cowl hood.

 

I was going to suggest that you consider going to a 650-750 range double pumper carb. A 3310 is great for street use but I tend to believe on the track you want that double squirter. Along those same lines I would recommend dumping the RPM Air Gap and go with a good Single Plane Intake manifold. With the 383 stroker package and the compression you are running, and especially with the excellent flowing Trick Flow heads you should have no problem building HP and TQ with a High flow setup like this. I run a single plane with a 800 DP on my 454 and I still have plenty of TQ on the low side. Granted BB have lots of TQ anyway but I believe single plane manifolds are highly under rated when it comes to low end torque. Unless your car really bogs down when you change gears you should be able to maintain your R's high enough to be in your rpm range of your cam anyway. I would highly recommend going to a roller cam setup. The roller cams come in solid or hydraulic flavors and are about a 25-30HP gain just by being rollers. Of course that means the extra expense of those high dollar roller lifters and roller rockers but it is money well spent. The cam grind you mentioned above sounded like a bit much for you to still be able to run on the street but a good comp cams roller with .510 lift or so with an advertised duration (I can't remember what it would be at .050) of about .288 - .292 would be a great set up IMHO. Comp Cams makes some really radical grinds and I highly recommend them. Last but certainly not least and I'm surprised nobody mentioned it here because if your car is already running good now this would be my first choice is to go to a higher set of rear gears. 3.73's are a great all around street/strip gear and 3.90's is getting close to full race gear in my mind. 3.73's should give you that extra 1/10 or 2/10's that you are looking for alone, but they are pricey and to have them properly installed is very important. It requires special tools to do the job right but it is worth doing. I recommend professional installation (@ $200-250 to install) So all of this stuff costs money, LOL right??? My oppinion, car runs good as is get some lower gears to get down the track "quicker" since ET is the name of the game. Lower gears are like adding TQ and HP anyway in a sense. 3.55 is a good gear if your a big block and you like to drive on the street a lot, but if you are a small block and want to be able to play with the big boy's then you've got to have gears!!!!! (Especially those 440's, LOL they're nasty....) Traction bars and sub connectors, gears first to get you into the lower 12's high 11's (hopefully) LOL. Then Carb, Intake, Cam combo's later to work your way into the low 11's high 10's. Some more stuff for you to consider before the tax check gets there. Good Luck

Dale Ellerbe
Radical'68 SS Z28 Clone LeMans Blue
600HP 454 ,11.1,Comp Cams Solid Roller 288 w/.622 lift, Holley 800 DP, 225HP N2O, TCI T-400 manual, Competition Engineering, Richmond 3:73's, 10 bolt posi
ET: ???? No track around here. But fun to drive on the street!!!!

 

There is a lot of good info in the above posts. I agree with the 750 double pumper and a cam change. I would call and talk to Comp about it. Weight is another helper. One thing to remember is that gaining a number in you 60 foot time will normally gain you two numbers on the long end. I went through this and it works out. Say, you knock a 10th off you 60, you should see around a two 10ths off you ET. I have the SSM lift bars and they are a great place to start. You get subframe connectors, lift bars, drive shaft loop and a crossmember to tighten things up. From there, you can get a cage and tie it into the crossmember for an even more solid chassis.

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------------------
Mark

1992 Firebird 355/Six Speed
1991 RS 350 / 700-R4
1987 Toyota Pickup 383 / 500 + HP 10.79 @ 123.95 Slicks / 11.997 @ 114.23 Radials
"Speed KILLS, so drive a FORD and live forever!"
http://personal.lig.bellsouth.net/~racer383/

Member of the "unwanted" 3rd Gen group.

 

South Side Machine lift bars and Competition Engineering subframe connectors are on their way - maybe I'll get them installed by Saturday and get to run the car. I'll let you guys know what they do for me.

As for cams Dale - that Crane roller cam looked like it had a "fair" idle and a power band from 3000 to 6200 according to desktop dyno with my combo. Maybe I shouldn't trust Desktop Dyno quite so much - any particular reason you think it is too radical? I do drive the car on the street a lot and don't want it to be too cantankerous. Any particular Comp Camps grind you would recommend? BTW Advertised duration on the Crane is 292* I / 300* E.

The 3.55 gears are brand new (at least to me) and I am running 3100 RPM at 60 mph - about the max RPM I feel comfortable cruising down the highway at. I am crossing the traps at 5500 RPM at 107 MPH - I could probably use a bit more gear right now, but if I come up with 50 extra horsepower I don't want to run out of gear. I'd like to see trap speeds in the 115 - 120 mph range down the road, so I'm hoping the 3.55's will get me there.

Eric

 

You did not mention which Trick Flow heads you have. The G2 version is limited to .500 lift without trick flow pistons that have the "twisted" valve reliefs. Just thought you should know. Their 23 degree replacement heads don't have the twisted valve setup.

------------------
67 Camaro, 355, Trick Flow G2 heads,RPM intake, XE274, TH350 with Hughes 3000, 4.10 posi

 

kereed57 - My heads are the 64cc 23 degree variety. Didn't know about the .500 lift limit with the G2's though, interesting. I'm running full floating KB pistons for 5.7" rods. The pistons have a 12cc dish so I don't expect any valve clearance problems. I'll be sure to check though if I pick a higher lift cam.

 

i got 4 tenths switching from the deh 275 to the comp XE284, and minor port work on the heads

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'68 with a 355 and dart pro1 heads, XE284 comp cam, air-gap intake, th350 w/3000 stall and 3.73 gears.
'69 SS with a 427 with edelbrock alum heads, comp cam, performer rpm intake, 750 street dominator carb with a muncie 4-speed and 4.11 gears

 

Just a few suggestions that shouldn`t cost much money. These were worth some time on my S-10 blazer: Shutoff alternator with a switch= 1-1/2 tenths. Homemade cold ram air setup= 2 tenths and 3 mph. Exhaust cutouts= 2-1/2 tenths. Removing the sway bar did nothing for 60` times. I run 90/10 lakewood front shocks with moroso trick springs up front and southside machine lift bars in back with 50/50 lakewood shocks. 255/50/16 drag radials. 1.59 60ft times with front wheels 6" off the ground. With the sway bar it actually handles well on the street. A 750 dp should be worth some hp also. Good luck, Brent

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Prostreet 67 L-78 SS 396 project. Daily driven S-10 blazer: 355/700r4. 12.56 et. @ 108 mph.

 

well Eric the reason I suggested a slightly less cam was because you wanted to drive it on the street a lot. Most people I've heard on here that want to drive on the street don't want too much so I just assumed you were considering something like that. I drive my 68 on the street about 2-3 times a week and I'm running a CB-288-R10 and it is pretty radical. The .288 duration doesn't sound like much but with the .622 lift it has one bad *** sound and it really turns heads. LOL Personally if I'm going to put something together that I plan on taking to the track anyway, I'd go for as much as I could stand on the street to as long as I can pass inspection and it's street legal. LOL Kind of falls back to the one discussion on here "Run what you brung". As far as the gears I know where you're coming from on that too. I originally had 3:08's in my 10 bolt (Moser 12 bolt to come when I win the lotto........couldn't pay me enough to put a Ford product under my chassis...LOL) and with a BB they are historically known for not handling the high revving racing action without special mod's (I ain't an expert by any stretch of the imagination, I just go on what I've learned or heard, a lot of which I've learned right hear from guys like Mark Whining, Big Gear Head, David Pozzi, and my own personal observations) but I know that was part of my decision not to go to 4.11's in my car because I'd be redling before I got to the end of the 1/4, but I can run my BB up to about 6500 to shift and feel comfortable redlining at 7,000 on the top. Your 383 should be able to handle the rpm range up to the 6500 range no problem if it was put together right so you have to decide where you want that power. My cam is supposed to make power from 3500-6500 so my 3500 stall is about right for that combo. Cam selection is a real individual type decision, what may be good for me may not be what you are looking for. Stall speed, trans brake, gear ratio, car weight all have to be considered when selecting your cam. Others here have a much better grip on that than I do. That's my two cents worth. Interesting note on those twisted wedge heads though wasn't it? I didn't know that either. Interesting.

 

I ran your combo thru my engine and drag analyser...I came up with a 12.44@108 with your current combo. I then made the following changes...switch to comp cams 280 magnum (single pattern 230@.050, .480 lift, 110/106), victor jr. intake, and uncorked exhaust...this showed massive tire spin but could be walked out of the hole to 12.0's. I then added a set of 28"x9" slicks and got 11.79@114.09 mph. Adding a 3500 stall convertor and 3.90 gears showed 11.60@115.03, all shifting done at 6000 rpm (to be safe). One thing to think about...those trick flow heads have an excellent intake to exhaust flow ratio...you may be losing power by using a cam with 10 degrees more exhaust duration because of over scavaging.
Oh, and by using your existing 3.55's, slicks, uncorked headers, 3000 stall, victor jr, and a comp cams 286 hydraulic roller (230/230, .560/.560, 110/106) I got 11.50@116.98. With the drag radials I got 11.88@117.59 with the tires spinning almost 1/4 of the way down the track. This was shifting at 6500 since power peaked at 6000.
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375hp 78 Chevy truck
77 Chevy Nova
95 Chevy Lumina 3.4L
and building a 78 Nova

[This message has been edited by travis (edited 06-13-2001).]

[This message has been edited by travis (edited 06-13-2001).]

 

Better Carb,
M/T ET DRAGS
lose some weight(in the car)
becareful with the gas tank, not enough fuel, it could slosh and be without gas for a second when you launch, that cost me a win one time, it bogged,

 

Subframe connectors and SSM lift bars are installed. No chance to go to the track yet, but I can feel a difference out of the hole on the street.

I called Comp Cams cam help line. When I explained I am considering either a roller or solid lifter cam they suggested their 294 Solid Magnum cam - 248* intake and exhaust / 525 lift intake and exhaust.

They said that a hydraulic roller cam is not much of a gain for the money over a flat tappet solid lifter cam - interesting. A solid roller would be a big gain over the flat tappet solid lifter cam, but the roller is hard on valve train components.

I think that the cam they suggested is a bit radical for me but the next step smaller 282S looks like it would be pretty good.

Anyone running either the 282S or the 294S solid cams out there?

Thanks for running the numbers Travis. I think I'm getting close to getting this 11 sec combo nailed down.

 

The 275deh cam is a mild street cam good to 5700, I would try the Comp 230/236, it should make good power past 6000.

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67RS STREET CAR, 502 PUMPGAS, HYD. ROLLER, TH350 w/ATI 10" 12-BOLT w/373 - 10.92@125.2 ON MOTOR, ET-STREETs w/MUFFLERS

 

67rs502, That's a wicked combo you've got there - sounds sweet. BTW welcome to the site. The 275 DEH makes good power to 5800 as you say, but with a 106 degree LSA it's not quite as mild as you may think.

I guess that's part of the whole cam picture - the affect of lsa on idle and power band. The 282S and 294S has a 110 lsa which is wider than I've run before.

 

Actually, the 275DEH has 110 lca...the intake centerline is 106 (if installed straight up...cam has 4 degrees advance ground in)...this is the same with all high energy and magnum cams, plus most of the extreme energy cams.

------------------
375hp 78 Chevy truck
77 Chevy Nova
95 Chevy Lumina 3.4L
and building a 78 Nova

 

instead of opening the engine again why not put 1.6 rockers is there a performance curve in the dist. ? how about a 1" spacer under carb. maybe 90/10 still front shocks pully on alternator to slow it down a drag race still front end alignment maybe shorter tires for track to compensate for street gears what I am getting at there are a hundred things you might try before opening her up again take the front sway bar off at track check fuel pressure take the surrated edges off the a arm bushing so the front end act quicker most of this stuff is stock eliminator ideas to cheat a car in thinking is has bigger heuvos